When should we expect to see instructions to switch to OPVault?

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AMCarter3
AMCarter3
Community Member

I'm currently using Dropbox to sync my 1P database across 3 computers, 2 iPads and 2 iPhones. I read the blog "When a Leak Isn’t a Leak" with interest. I'm tempted to follow your instructions using Terminal to make the switch... I've used Terminal off and on for years and am not afraid of using it. However, I'd rather not take the risk with something as important to us as our 1P database. So, roughly when should we expect to see your instructions-for-dummies to switch to OPVault?


1Password Version: 54.1
Extension Version: 4.4.3
OS Version: OS X 10.10.5
Sync Type: Dropbox
Referrer: kb:switch-to-opvault

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  • littlebobbytables
    littlebobbytables
    1Password Alumni
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    Greetings @AMCarter3,

    Have you seen this page yet? Switching to OPVault from Agile Keychain. It might be you're looking for something more explicit or maybe this is exactly what you're looking for, we'll see what you think :smile:

    One point I'd like to make though. If you have ever imported information from another piece of software into 1Password and used MrC's convertor then we're aware of a bug in 1Password that we've fixed in the beta. As you can probably surmise, I'm mentioning it here as the bug relates to the OPVault container and how it can appear items are missing when viewed in 1Password for iOS. If you download the beta before starting it will correctly account for the bug and you won't be affected.

    Does any of this help at all? if you have thoughts about the guide do please let us know :smile:

  • AMCarter3
    AMCarter3
    Community Member
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    Yes, I did see that guideline. That why I asked the question. I'm sure you do not expect most users to leap into Terminal and be able to accurately follow the instructions in that "Switching" article. As I said, although I am not afraid of using Terminal, I'd rather not take the risk with something as important to us as my 1P database. I know what it is like to have my database get scrambled and out of sync with my devices. It took literally months to resolve the mess. So, back to my question... when should we expect to you to release an update to 1P that includes no-brainer instructions to migrate from Dropbox to OPVault?

  • Drew_AG
    Drew_AG
    1Password Alumni
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    Hi @AMCarter3,

    Sorry for any confusion about that! To answer your question:

    So, roughly when should we expect to see your instructions-for-dummies to switch to OPVault?

    If you're asking when OPVault will be made the default sync format for Dropbox sync, I'm afraid I don't have a timeframe at this point. We're definitely working on it, but I don't know which version will first make it the default setting, or when that version will be released. What I can tell you is that OPVault is the default sync format for Dropbox sync in the latest beta version, although that doesn't necessarily mean it will be the default setting in the next stable release.

    I've used Terminal off and on for years and am not afraid of using it. However, I'd rather not take the risk with something as important to us as our 1P database.

    The Terminal command doesn't have anything to do with the 1Password database on your Mac. All it does it change a sync setting. When you enable Dropbox sync for a vault in 1Password, it puts a copy of your vault data in Dropbox. Currently, the sync file it creates in Dropbox is in the Agile Keychain format. The Terminal command simply changes a preference within 1Password so that the next time you enable Dropbox sync for a vault, it will create a new sync file in the OPVault format instead of the Agile Keychain format.

    The reason you need to enter a Terminal command to change that setting is because it's an internal setting which doesn't currently have a visible option to change it in the 1Password app. So to change the setting, you just need to copy & paste the Terminal command. Even if you somehow did something wrong when copying/pasting that command, the worst that could happen is that the setting isn't changed.

    Keep in mind that if you use the Terminal command, that doesn't actually convert an existing .agilekeychain file to an .opvault file. You will also need to disable & re-enable Dropbox sync for your vault(s) in 1Password (as described in Step 3).

    But if you decide not to use the Terminal command, that fine - using the Agile Keychain format for Dropbox sync does not mean your data is vulnerable. Please make sure you take a look at this post: Your passwords are safe when using the Agile Keychain format

    As it says in that post, the "Agile Keychain format keeps your sensitive data safe." If it didn't, we wouldn't continue to use it.

    I really hope this helps to clear up some things about switching to the OPVault sync format, but if you have more questions or concerns, please don't hesitate to let us know! :)

  • AMCarter3
    AMCarter3
    Community Member
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    Drew,

    Thanks for clarifying. If I was only using 1Password on one computer, I would likely follow the instructions to shift to OPVault as my default sync format now. However, since I have 3 computers, 2 iPads and 2 iPhones all syncing perfectly now, I do not feel clear enough to make the leap. And since, as you said, "using the Agile Keychain format for Dropbox sync does not mean your data is vulnerable", I think I'd prefer to just wait until you guys send us clear, simple instructions as part of an update to 1P.

    (Having felt the consequences of completely losing sync between our 7 devices for more than 2 months about a year ago, I am being very conservative about messing with my agilekeychain file... It took way too much effort and tech support to recover.)

  • Drew_AG
    Drew_AG
    1Password Alumni
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    Hi @AMCarter3,

    No problem - if you aren't comfortable with using the Terminal command, I agree that it makes more sense to continue using the Agile Keychain format with Dropbox sync for now. But if you change your mind, or if you need any help once OPVault is the default sync format, just let us know! :)

  • AMCarter3
    AMCarter3
    Community Member
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    Thanks, Drew... Using Terminal is not the issue. The big question / uncertainty I have about manually making the switch is: How do the instructions apply to each of my computers and devices? Do I just follow the instructions ONCE on my laptop and everything will be fine on our other 2 computers, 2 iPads and 2 iPhones? Or is there something else I should do on the other gear? That's what makes me nervous.

  • AMCarter3
    AMCarter3
    Community Member
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    I see in the text that the instructions for making the switch to OPVault must be applied to all computers (3 in my case). My question is, what needs to happen on iOS devices? Nothing?

  • Hey @AMCarter3! Great questions. Let's see if I can help answer them.

    How do the instructions apply to each of my computers and devices? Do I just follow the instructions ONCE on my laptop and everything will be fine on our other 2 computers, 2 iPads and 2 iPhones? Or is there something else I should do on the other gear?

    You'll need to follow the instructions on your computers, but not on your mobile devices. The guide specifically helps you change the vault creation format to OPVault rather than Agile Keychain. All you have to do is change the setting on both your computers so new vaults aren't created with Agile Keychain, then convert your current vaults. Step 3 of the guide is specifically for converting your old vaults. Once you do that, you'll need to cycle syncing on your other devices so they use the new vaults as well.

    I see in the text that the instructions for making the switch to OPVault must be applied to all computers (3 in my case). My question is, what needs to happen on iOS devices? Nothing?

    As I mentioned above, all you need to do is disable and re-enable syncing. When you enable it again, you'll be asked which vault to sync with, and you can choose the OPVault from the list (if you have more than one, you can do this multiple times for each one). To disable sync on an iOS device, open 1Password, switch to the Settings tab, and tap Sync. Tap Sync Service and tap Disable Sync. Once it's disabled, tap Start Syncing, then tap Sync with Dropbox, select your account and vault, and you're all set. :)

    On your Macs, cycling sync is a matter of opening the app, clicking the 1Password menu in the menu bar, clicking Preferences, and switching to the Sync tab. From there, click the vault you want to disable and re-enable syncing on, then click the Dropbox dropdown menu and click None. Confirm your choice by selecting Disable Sync. Since you removed the data from Dropbox when you initially changed things to OPVault, you shouldn't have to do that again. To enable sync again, click the dropdown menu that now says None and select Dropbox. Then navigate to your OPVault, select it, and click Open. You will be asked if you'd like to merge the vault, which is perfectly fine so long as it's the same vault. ;) Simply click Merge with Existing to continue.

    That's it! You're all done. Let us know how that goes. :) We're here if you have any questions.

  • AMCarter3
    AMCarter3
    Community Member
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    Question... Your instructions appear to have a space before the word 'defaults' in the Terminal command " defaults write 2BUA8C4S2C.com.agilebits.onepassword4-helper useOPVaultFormatByDefault true. Is that accurate?

  • @AMCarter3 That's simply for indentation in the article. Running the command with the space or without will achieve the same effect. :)

  • AMCarter3
    AMCarter3
    Community Member
    edited November 2015
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    It did not work. Some step is missing. Here's what I did on my computer (before doing anything on my other 2 computers):
    1. Quit 1Password > Quit 1Password and 1Password mini
    2. Copy/pasted "defaults write 2BUA8C4S2C.com.agilebits.onepassword-osx-helper useOPVaultFormatByDefault true" to Terminal and hit Return.
    3. Opened 1P and disabled sync pref for the Dropbox vault.
    4. Choose the “Delete data from Dropbox” option when prompted.

    When I re-enabled Dropbox Sync in 1P, it shows the same "1Password.agilekeychain"... not "1Password.OPvault". I did not get list of vaults to sync with... It only shows Dropbox or Folder. OPVault is not in the list. And, the "1Password.agilekeychain" file is still there in my Dropbox "1Password" folder.

    So, what am I missing? Am I supposed to restart the computer? I tried restarting 1P -- nothing changed What now?

  • @AMCarter3 First off, there's a difference between the Terminal command you posted previously and the one you just posted. The previous one was for the AgileBits Store version of 1Password, and the most recent one was for the Mac App Store version of the app. Could you check to find out which version you have before running the command? You need to then run the one specifically for the version you have in order for things to work properly. :) Let us know how that goes.

  • AMCarter3
    AMCarter3
    Community Member
    edited November 2015
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    Sorry to add confusion. My 1P is from the Agile Web Store and I did use the AgileBits Store Terminal command. I just verified both. In fact, I used the Terminal command twice - the 2nd was after I sent my message that it did not work. No effect both times.

    I just did the Web Store Terminal command again (3rd time); restarted 1P; and still do not see an OPvault option in the dropdown menu for syncing my Primary vault with Dropbox. All it shows is Dropbox and Folder. I'm going to try restarting my computer. Perhaps you have other suggestions?

  • AMCarter3
    AMCarter3
    Community Member
    edited November 2015
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    MY ERROR. I WAS USING THE WRONG TERMINAL SCRIPT. just did the correct Terminal command; restarted 1P; but still do NOT see the OPvault option in the dropdown menu for Dropbox.

    Tried this 3 times. No effect.

  • @AMCarter3 Glad you got things sorted out with the correct Terminal command. :) It sounds like there's a bit more confusion as far as the OPVault option goes. To clarify: Running that command does not enable another option in the sync menu. All it does is change the format. You'll need to disable and enable sync once again as I mentioned in my previous post to change the format. Could you please try that and let us know how it goes?

  • AMCarter3
    AMCarter3
    Community Member
    edited November 2015
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    I think I have followed your re-sync instructions to the T on my computer multiple times. You said:

    "On your Macs, click the 1Password menu in the menu bar, clicking Preferences, and switching to the Sync tab. From there, click the vault you want to disable and re-enable syncing on, then click the Dropbox dropdown menu and click None. Confirm your choice by selecting Disable Sync. Since you removed the data from Dropbox when you initially changed things to OPVault, you shouldn't have to do that again. To enable sync again, click the dropdown menu that now says None and select Dropbox. Then navigate to your OPVault, select it, and click Open. You will be asked if you'd like to merge the vault, which is perfectly fine so long as it's the same vault. ;) Simply click Merge with Existing to continue."

    First, The only part I do not understand is "Confirm your choice by selecting "Disable Sync". I do not see the words, "Disable Sync" anywhere in the pref window box. The only option I see for disabling Sync is to select NONE, which I have done (4 times). Is that what you mean by disabling Sync?

    Secondly, these instructions say "Since you removed the data from Dropbox when you initially changed things to OPVault, you shouldn't have to do that again." The fact is, running the AgileBits Store Terminal command did NOT remove the data from my Dropbox. It is still there. Am I supposed to manually remove/delete the "1password.agilekeychain" file in my Dropbox folder? (I would attach a PDF screen shot, but this forum apparently will not accept PDF screenshots).

  • @AMCarter3 As I mentioned, you first have to click the dropdown menu, then click None, then click Disable Sync. Once you click none, you'll be presented with the following:

    If you don't see that, let me know. If you do, simply click Disable Sync and you should be set. When you first do it, it's good to note that you should also check the box beside Delete data from Dropbox so you can change that data to the OPVault format. That will remove the data so you don't have to manually do so later. Please have a look at those what I said before a bit more closely for info on this. If you have any questions, I'm happy to help out.

    If you're still a bit confused and would like to chat about another means of communicating, we'd be happy to arrange that as well. Just send us an email at support+forums@agilebits.com and include a link to this thread. Post back here with the BitBot confirmation number once you send that email and we'll see what we can do. :)

  • AMCarter3
    AMCarter3
    Community Member
    edited November 2015
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    As I said, I do NOT see what you see. How can I send you a screenshot? What format is needed? I tried PDF. Does it now work in Firefox?

  • AMCarter3
    AMCarter3
    Community Member
    edited November 2015
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    Here's a screen shot: (by the way, this file upload feature only seems to work in Safari; not Firefox).

    Also, here's is my Dropbox folder:

  • AMCarter3
    AMCarter3
    Community Member
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    This is very frustrating. I did not want to spend so many hours today on this. I should not have started it. It has become exactly what I feared -- a time consuming process of debugging our communications and trying over and over to do something you think is clear and simple. Unless I can get it to work within the next 30 mins., I request instructions on how to go BACK to sync'ing with my agilekeychain file in Dropbox.

  • @AMCarter3 Sorry for the confusion there. The screenshot you posted helps clear things up. Which computer is this on? The original one that you changed things to OPVault and then removed syncing, or one of the other ones that you need to set up sync with again? I know this is a bit confusing, and I'm sorry about that. If that screenshot was taken from one of your other computers, did it have sync enabled in the first place or was it always off?

  • AMCarter3
    AMCarter3
    Community Member
    edited November 2015
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    I am ONLY working on my primary Macbook AIR. I have not touched the other computers. Here's another shot of my Sync pref showing only Dropbox and Folder as the options:

  • @AMCarter3 All right, at this point it really is best to move things to email so we can discuss things in a bit more detail and so I can get some other details from you. I'm sorry it's been an inconvenience, but we are happy to help you work it out. As I mentioned before, please, send us an email at support+forums@agilebits.com and include a link to this thread. Post back here with the BitBot confirmation number once you send that email and we'll see what we can do. :)

  • AMCarter3
    AMCarter3
    Community Member
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    I sent the email. What does "Post back here with the BitBot confirmation number" mean? Is that the support ID [#MRI-62119-937] ??

  • AMCarter3
    AMCarter3
    Community Member
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    Thanks. I'm all set to do a call tomorrow AM.

  • @AMCarter3 Thanks so much for sending that over and for setting things up. We'll wrap things up via email. If you have any other questions, feel free to let us know. :+1:

    ref: #MRI-62119-937

  • AMCarter3
    AMCarter3
    Community Member
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    I do appreciate you guys being there. It's just difficult when something supposed to be simple blossoms into hours and hours without resolution. I'm hopeful we'll get it solved tomorrow.

  • I'm with you on that. :) We should be able to get things going smoothly again very soon.

  • AMCarter3
    AMCarter3
    Community Member
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    BTW... is it accurate that it is not possible to attach files here when using Firefox?

  • Jacob
    edited November 2015
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    @AMCarter3 It should work fine. I just tried in the latest version of Firefox on Mac by dragging and dropping, and by clicking the file icon in the compose box, and selecting Browse. Are you not seeing that button?

This discussion has been closed.