Folder Sync Help Needed - syncing via ChronoSync from 1P 3 to 1P 4 [Moved to email]
My setup:
- MBP 10.6.8, 1Password 3.8.20 (work) (ChronoSyncA--)
- MBA 10.9.5, 1Password 4.4.1 (ChronoSyncB++)
- MacMini, 10.9.5, 1Password 4.4.1 (Wi-Fi Sync++) (ChronoSyncA--) (ChronoSyncB++)
- iPhone, 8.0, 1Password 5.0.1 (Wi-Fi Sync++)
The MBP is my work machine. I add new logins or change them while browsing on this laptop.
I want to use the MacMini as a central store for passwords.
I have the iPhone paired to the MacMini via wi-fi sync. This is working.
I use ChronoSync to sync the 1Password.agilekeychain on the MBP to a file in a sync folder on the MacMini.
I have another Chronosync transfer from the MacMini to the MBA.
When I make login changes on the MBP and then sync the data file to the MacMini, the changes do not carry through to the MacMini. Thus the MBA and iPhone will also not get updated with the latest changes.
Is this a v3 versus v4 compatibility issue? or am I wrong in my expectations about the data file sync functionality?
Comments
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Hi @alembic,
Thanks for taking the time to contact us. I'm sorry that you are having some trouble.
I edited your post for readability and added some "tags" to the list at the top to help me keep track of how you have everything set up. I hope you don't mind.
Phew! It took a minute to process, but I think I understand the issue. You've got quite the system for this — which is awesome and should be working well. Let's try to figure out why ChronoSync wouldn't be keeping the data up to date between your MacBook Pro and your Mac mini.
One thing to note, though, is that the following settings are required (or at least they used to be) to sync the 1Password data file correctly:
- Unidirectional Sync Only — Make sure you set it to sync from the newest to the oldest computer
- Dissect Packages ON — In the Options panel, under “Special File/Folder Handling”, switch to “Custom” and check “Dissect Packages”
I'm going to try to verify that the those settings are still required, but I'd be interested to know how things work if you give them a try. Its sounds like you know what you're doing, but don't hesitate to let me know if you need further clarification. I'd be happy to provide more details. :)
Cheers!
ref: DOCS-226
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I double-checked, and it sounds like "Dissect Packages" should definitely be enabled. It certainly wouldn't' hurt to enable "Unidirectional Sync" as well since 1Password has no way to know if something else (like ChronoSync) is writing the data. Some folks have reported no problems with bidirectional sync, but I suspect they are just not trying to write on both Macs at the same time. I think it could cause problems if one is not careful, and I'd hate to see something bad happen to your data no matter how many backups you may have.
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@khad, thanks for formatting my original post.
I have the two attributes set in ChronoSync for the transfer between the MBP and MacMini.
What I'm unsure about is the requirement, "sync from the newest to the oldest computer".
Does "newest" refer to the time stamp of the folder or files to sync (because of the uni-directional sync), or the OS versions of the two computers, or 1Password versions installed on the two computers?
In the last case, I was wondering if synchronizing the .agilekeychain file from a 3.x install (MBP) to a 4.x install (MacMini) could be the problem?
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Let me clarify that the file sync is working if I look at the time stamps of the source and destination .agilekeychain folders. So if I delete a 10 logins on the MBP and do a manual sync via ChronoSync, then open 1Password on the MacMini, those 10 logins are still listed.
One thing I could check is to do a content diff between the .agilekeychain folders. i.e. maybe the file sync is just not reporting an error but also not really doing an update.
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I should have mentioned this earlier, but be sure your backups are up to date before we go too far with all this. :)
Does "newest" refer to the time stamp of the folder or files to sync (because of the uni-directional sync), or the OS versions of the two computers, or 1Password versions installed on the two computers?
Good question. You'll want to unidirectionally sync your 1Password data from the "source" Mac to the one you want to match the source. In my case, my primary machine is a laptop. I would sync the data from my laptop to my desktop and not make any changes on the desktop — treating the desktop as essentially read-only.
Try turning off the "Unidirectional Sync". I'm wondering if that alone will clear things up. I don't suspect it will, but it would be interesting to see.
What I'm thinking, though, is that the issue is 1Password isn't being notified of changes to the file system, so it doesn't think there is new data is needs to reload. If you quit 1Password with Control-Command-Q (which quits both 1Password and 1Password mini) and the relaunch, do you see the data appear?
In the last case, I was wondering if synchronizing the .agilekeychain file from a 3.x install (MBP) to a 4.x install (MacMini) could be the problem?
It really shouldn't be an issue since the format is the same for both. agilekeychain is agilekeychain regardless of which version is reading and writing it.
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I'm not sure why backups need to be updated? As long as the agilekeychain files are synchronized, both 1Password applications on the MBP and MacMini should display identical items. That's what I expect anyway.
I tried manually copying the agilekeychain from the MBP to the MacMini. These files are from the ~/Library/Application Support/1Password4/ directories on both machines. And I still cannot get the same list of items on the MacMini.
Also, I noticed on the MacMini that the Category item counts are inaccurate. I deleted all items, emptied the trash, restarted the app, and it still shows non-zero counts for Logins, Secure Notes, etc.
I still don't know what is meant by "newest" but I suspect it's a reference to file time stamps? Please confirm.
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I also tried backing up the data file on the MBP, transferred it over to the MacMini, renamed it (since v4 appears to ignore v3 backup files), and restored from it. It does not import any data.
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Hi @alembic,
I'm not sure why backups need to be updated?
Khad was recommending you have current backups of your 1Password data to restore in case something goes wrong.
I tried manually copying the agilekeychain from the MBP to the MacMini. These files are from the ~/Library/Application Support/1Password4/ directories on both machines.
What do you have configured to store Agile Keychain vaults (folders) in that non-standard location, which is used for storing the internal database? There's more explanation about this in my earlier Local Syncing reply to you, where I asked:
The recommended approach, however, is to use Dropbox syncing for a system/device/software combination like this. :)
>
Are there any specific reasons you'd prefer not to use it?
That would make what you're trying to accomplish a whole lot easier. :)
I also mentioned:
On your MacBook Pro running Snow Leopard, 1Password 3 could then be configured to use the same Agile Keychain wherever it's been configured with folder syncing on the other two Macs.
That's superseded by using ChronoSync for syncing data between local folders on all three Macs, like you've explained in this thread.
I want to use the MacMini as a central store for passwords.
Is it necessary that you're able to add and modify items on all the Macs and iPhone?
Also, I noticed on the MacMini that the Category item counts are inaccurate. I deleted all items, emptied the trash, restarted the app, and it still shows non-zero counts for Logins, Secure Notes, etc.
I'm not sure yet what's happening there.
One immediate suggestion is to get the Agile Keychain vaults out of ~/Library/Application Support/1Password 4/ on the MBA and mini. If you currently have Folder Sync configured to store them there you can reconfigure it on both Macs to use a location like ~/Documents/1Password instead. And ChronoSync will need reconfiguration as well; we're still looking into the ideal options for its usage.
Where is the Agile Keychain vault stored on your MBP that's running 1Password 3? Its default location is ~/Library/Application Support/1Password/1Password.agilekeychain.
I still don't know what is meant by "newest" but I suspect it's a reference to file time stamps? Please confirm.
That's correct.
Thanks for your patience with helping us help you get this sorted out. :)
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@sjk, my MacMini is configured as the contacts, calendar, reminders, tasks, notes sync server. I'm not interested in storing vital data on public servers and it's fun to get this stuff working on my own.
So when I modify contact's address or cell number from the MBP, MBA or iPhone, for example, the change is pushed to the other two devices almost instantaneously.
I'm trying to set up something similar with my 1Password vault; I think though that the wi-fi sync on the iPhone only pulls data from the MacMini, not push changes made on the iPhone to the MacMini?
My primary vault on the MBP is stored in the default location:
~\Library\Application Support\1Password\1Password.agilekeychain
On the MacMini, I've set 1Password to sync to this location:
~\Documents\ChronoSync Documents\1Password\1Password.agilekeychain
I use ChronoSync to synchronize, one-way, any changes made to the 1Password folder on the MBP to the MacMini 1Password folder. ChronoSync is configured to only monitor changes to the MBP's 1Password.agilekeychain.
To remove ChronoSync as a failure point, I manually copied the MBP's 1Password.agilekeychain onto the MacMini, overwriting the existing one; this did not update 1Password items on the MacMini after restarting the application.
What did work is to export all 1Password items from the MBP into a 1Password Interchange File, copy it over to the Mac Mini and perform an import of that data into 1Password.
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Thanks for that additional information, @alembic.
I've been discussing strategies with one of my colleagues to help you get everything configured correctly. We agreed that the preferable next step is moving this discussion into private email to work through all the specific configuration details with you.
To do that, please send us a Diagnostics Report from all three of your Macs, plus a link to this topic and your forum username, to support+forum@agilebits.com. If you leave a quick comment here after you've sent the reports we'll keep an extra eye open for them. :)
After reviewing the reports we'll be able to better assist you with a solution for this issue. Thanks in advance!
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I've sent the three diagnostic reports. Thanks!
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Hi @alembic,
Thanks for sending that Report in! I took a quick look in our system, but I was unable to find an email from the address you attached to your forum account. If you could send me a private message with the address that you used to send in the Report, I'd be happy to track it down and ensure that it gets answered quickly. :)
EDIT:
After our private message conversation, I was able to locate your email in our system. I've updated the email thread with the necessary details from this forum discussion so that it is easier for our support team to get up to speed with the issue. Someone from the support team will get back to you as soon as possible with some further information. We'll keep the conversation going directly via email to avoid complicating things between here and there. :)
ref: MKG-16548-911
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I have this working and here's my configuration:
On the MacMini, 1Password v4 is sync'ed to a local folder containing the 1Password.agilekeychain package.
On the MacBookAir, 1Password v4 is sync'ed to a local folder containing the 1Password.agilekeychain package.
On the MacBookPro, 1Password v3 uses the 1Password.agilekeychain package in the logged in user's default application support folder.
ChronoSync bi-directional sync document connects the MacMini sync folder and the MBA sync folder.
ChronoSync bi-directional sync document connects the MacMini sync folder and the MBP 1Password.agilekeychain package.
Both sync documents are configured to synchronize deletions, verify copied data, dissect packages and preserve extended attributes.
I also installed ChronoAgent on the MacMini. This allows ChronoSync to skirt AFP to create direct connections over the local network. Simply, it facilitates faster and more reliable syncing. If you have ChronoSync and your target volumes are on network Apple-native storage, this is a great $10 add-on. A bit more on this later.
ChronoSync does not initiate a sync via real-time monitoring of changes to the contents of source/target folders. But a sync document can be scheduled to run as frequently as desired. My 1Password.agilekeychain takes only several seconds to update so theoretically I could schedule a sync to run every 20 seconds.
The end result is that if I make a change to a login on the MBA, within a minute this will be updated in 1Password v4 on the MacMini which refreshes the login list when ChronoSync does its thing. The same result occurs in the other direction.
Because 1Password v3 does not have a folder sync option, any changes made on other network devices do not show as updates on the MacBookPro until I quit and restart 1Password v3.
I use the wi-fi sync option in 1Password v4 on the MacMini to sync up my iPhone running 1Password v5. This sync is also bi-directional. Changes made on the iPhone gets sent to the MacMini and then to other devices on the network. The MacMini, however, does not push changes to the iPhone. The iPhone app must initiate a pull to update its keychain data.
Finally, ChronoSync's vendor offers a free iOS utility, Interconnex, which can access the file system of the machine running ChronoAgent. Because I have a domain pointing to the MacMini with a static IP address, I can browse and download any file from the MacMini to my iPhone when I'm outside my LAN (so long as I have an Internet connection). Transfers are encrypted and the utility has a set of actions to manipulate files and folders on the iPhone.
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Hi @alembic,
Thanks so much for the detailed description of how you've configured syncing of your 1Password data. I'm really happy you could it working with all the right pieces in all the right places!
Since you've got this nicely sorted out now, I'll close this thread again. Please reply to the email I sent you earlier if you have further questions, concerns, or would like this thread reopened so you can add to it. Also feel free to start a new topic or email us directly at support@agilebits.com and we'll take care of you. :)
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