I have to leave this "Early Access" forum ...
I can not read anymore the "whitewashing" of v8 by the 1Password team.
I can not read anymore the statements by the 1Password team telling us how great v8 is, how fast and new and everything else.
But at the same time I read endless comments (not only here) by users (!) about the failed GUI, the user experience, the interaction. So many users giving detailed constructive feedback, saying that v8 goes to the wrong direction, that v8 is huge step backwards, a regression. About lots of bugs and "simple" mistakes in the app. Users have to teach the 1Password team about GUI and user interaction!
But AgileBits does not listen to them - does not understand. Is fixing only smaller bugs.
I can not stay here longer to see how 1Password (for Mac) gets buried.
One person less which believed in that the 1Password team will understand and have a break from continuing to develop the actual v8. To rethink, to redesign v8.
Good bye.
You can delete this post or place it at the end of "Early Access", I dont mind anymore. I am just disappointed.
1Password Version: Not Provided
Extension Version: Not Provided
OS Version: Not Provided
Comments
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To a certain extent, I’m not sure what else we can expect. As disappointed as I am with the way things are going, I don’t expect an AgileBits employee to come in and say “Yeah! I hate that Electron crap!” It’s out of the hands of the people we’re talking to (which is, incidentally, why I would stress anyone to use polite and reasoned tones when expressing grievances).
Honestly, I was surprised when a support employee agreed with me that they miss the rubberbanding when scrolling.
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I'm sorry to see you go, @claus. I hope we can win you back some day. 🙏🏻
It's our first beta and there's definitely places we can improve. At the same time I'm happy and excited about using React+CSS for the UI and Rust for the backend. There's no malice and I hope our paths cross again in the future.
++dave;
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What they could say @tiltowaitt is “we won’t ship this until we have an app for Mac that feels like an app for the Mac.”
They could say they’re going to fix the broken, unmovable preferences “window.”
They could say they’re going to fix the new item menu so that it isn’t restricted to the height of the window and never requires scrolling.
They could say they’re going to fix the lack of animation in the collapse/reveal items in the sidebar.
They could say they’re going to fix the improper capitalization in the pop-up menus.
People keep bringing up UI issues and they either ignore the comments or try to gaslight us with “this app [that feels like Linux] is our best Mac experience ever!!!!!!!!!!!”
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@KirkMcPike They’re already decided they aren’t going to delay and ship a real app and not a glorified webpage. By all means, express your dissatisfaction—it’s why I’m here, too. But at this point, expecting them to just reverse course is unrealistic. Our only hope is that one of the following happens:
- They revisit this decision somewhere down the line and bring back a native app.
- Electron itself sees improvements that make it feel native.
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They could just admit the mistake, stop trying to dig heels in on "React is an amazing blah blah, Electron will get better" and just say "Ok we made a mistake, we will have a Native version released before we EOL 1PW7
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See, I personally have come to terms with Electron+Rust+React. While I think a native app would have been better and you could afford to develop it, I also understand the advantages of that stack.
With that said, I find the results so far to be unacceptable. The GUI is clunky and interacting with it clunky. I think you need to spend the next 6 months adjusting and polishing the GUI and really going as deep as possible to optimize things from a performance standpoint. You can change the design language and use web technologies, but windows should still draw and animate smoothly, scrolling should still feel good, and filling passwords should be instantaneous. You also need to figure out a way to put some guardrails around the memory and thread usage. Some additional overhead is tolerable, but 2x is not.
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@FCNV Poor draw performance is simply how Electron works. Open any Electron app, and you'll see it. This includes so-called "top-notch" Electron apps like VS Code. Ditto for scrolling. Hopefully they can at least get the Safari extension working quickly. It's unbearable now.
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@dteare : See, thats the point. v8 will be more or less the same as we see it now. Bug-fixing, some cosmetic
< At the same time I'm happy and excited about using React+CSS for the UI and Rust for the backend.
>When will you change the tack?! How much negative does it need to reach this point? It seems that the massive fundamental critics is not reaching you/the CEOs of AgileBits.
I wonder who really likes the v8 (beside the staff at AgileBits and, really, a very very very few guys in this forum)!? Where do you find/read positive feedback - I mean in other forums? Why do I not see it e.g. here? So how can you continue believe in that this is the right and good direction for 1Pwd.
I have also the feeling that so many users give you tips and trick for developing the app like there were no 1Passwords before. All what you have could have learned (and you knew it already) from the users about GUI, navigation, interaction - but almost nothing arrived in v8! Basic mistakes. If would have made such mistakes, my boss would have kicked me out of the company ...
So, please understand me correct, my critics is not personally against anyone at AgileBits. It is just that I am still so disappointed and can not believe that AgileBits is not showing to be able to move to a better direction.
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Ok, but we keep hearing how talented and devoted the 1Password development team is. Find a way to make it not suck. Be the first developers to figure out a way to make window drawing and scrolling nice. Then people can point to your app instead of Visual Studio Code.
But right now, I'm not seeing an app that gives me the impression that this 1Password team actually is that good. They just developed a crummy Electron app that a thousand other developers could have made.
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DTeare…
It's simple really…for most of us we're probably willing to accept subscription and the non native macOS app…but many users depend on some of the existing features like local vaults and DropBox. They might not provide all the gee whizzing features that the new corporate policy wants…but some users just might not want or need those features. I realize you're trying to grow the company considerably from it's current form…make more money, get more enterprise customers and all that jazz…and there's nothing wrong with that. However…essentially abandoning features that users want and use just because it's easier for your programmers simply doesn't sit well with some of us.
Each user of the current v7 has some combination of local vaults, online only, sync methods, native macOS app or whatever else that we use…and each user will have some that they're willing to accept and some that are dealbreakers. I downloaded and tried the Electron v8 beta yesterday (8/20/21)…and it's ugly and not very macOS like…but I could accept it if the things I think are deal breakers were fixed.
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@dteare what is bothering me is that before 1password 8 I was super super happy with 1Password. I love the iOS app. I love the Mac app. I love the browser extensions. The windows app was "ok" but it worked. I was happy paying my subscription for the service. Now with these changes I don't really see a difference between 1password and Dashlane. In fact, Dashlane has the feature to automatically change passwords. One thing I didn't like about them were their desktop apps and web interface. I felt 1password was the superior option to me. With the move to 1password 8, I don't really see a difference, and frankly I'm more likely to move. And it's nothing Dashlane did, it's what you and 1Password did.
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I don't know ... Dashlane is about the lowest effort Catalyst app you can make. I wouldn't be surprised if they just checked the box and hit compile. But I'll semi-agree. Bitwarden is suddenly a lot more attractive due to its lower price point. It's lacking a couple of features I like, though.
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I agree with all the comments above. I have been using 1P for nearly 15 years (I think), and this is the first retrograde step they have made. I do not know enough about Electron to discuss its limitations, but I do know that the early release app is ugly, doesn't work well and has removed some excellent features whilst providing absolutely nothing to mitigate this. I used V8 for several weeks and downgraded it today. 1P should be a facilitating app, not a constant source of frustration and an ugly blemish on my mac ecosystem. Sorry @dteare , I won't be upgrading to V8 any time soon and may well look at alternatives to 1P in the meantime.
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Remember that AgileBits originally had two interfaces to 1PW8, a native one and the Electron one. For some reason the native one did not work out. I don't think they had any choice but to release the Electron one with all its flaws (some of which are due to Electron, but many are because it is a beta). They could try using a different language for a native app (Catalyst or AppKit, they were trying SwiftUI). Judging from all the comments, I hope they will, though I am not at all sure that will do so. But I think they were right to release the Electron version to be going on with even if they do produce a native version later.
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Here is the point that I do not get: AgileBits does have a perfectly fine, functional, and pretty native user interface for 1Password on macOS. It is called 1Password 7. Replace the data layer by the new rust core, add whatever few new features remain, and call it 1Password 8?
Nothing to contribute here anymore unfortunately, so I am leaving this forum too. I cannot stand the constant, repetitive whitewashing alongside with a sprinkle of smileys.
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Good to read that people are not happy with v8,
Really, I was hoping AgileBits understand the problem, but they see only v8.
Nothing learned from the good points of the GUI from the pre versions of v8,0
