Support for Orion Browser

cmer

Please add support for the Orion browser. It needs explicit signature verification from 1Password to work. Otherwise, it should work out of the box.

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1Password Version: Not Provided
Extension Version: Not Provided
OS Version: Not Provided

ag_yaron

Hey @cmer ,

We don't plan on adding support for niche browsers. You can install 1Password for browsers on any Chromium based browser and it will work (just install the Chrome version of the extension), but it will not connect to the desktop app if the browser is not supported. You will still be able to autofill and save new logins though.

cmer

Orion is a Webkit-based browser that supports both Chrome and Firefox extensions. It is signed.

The extension works just fine but 1P won't autofill. It seems like 1P just needs to whitelist their application.

anquieta

I would appreciate this as well. Orion seems to be a potentially great alternate to Safari (especially after MacOS 12 and iOS/iPadOS 15 UI changes). The developers of Orion note that they've done everything they can on their end to be compatible with the classic 1Password extension. Like cmer noted, it already works, 1Password just needs to trust the browser signature for autofill to work. So hopefully a quick thing on your end without any additional work for ongoing support. Would really appreciate this.

hakusaro

@ag_yaron I'd like to throw my support in, but also add: I'm one of the most vocal supporters of 1Password, and not only that, but I'm a champion of 1Password for Business at my company. The 1Password Chromium extension doesn't support autofill, in my experience, on Orion. However, the desktop "classic" extension could "just work" if only 1Password provided support for it, or allowed users who are competent to bypass the signing check.

It's frustrating to be an ardent supporter of 1Password, and also to be told that because it's a niche browser, it can't be done. All that does is continue the existing browser monopoly: either you're Firefox, Chrome, or Safari, or you're a Sufficiently Big Company that you can launch a Chromium derived browser and get support because you can cheat (Edge). Any actual upcoming competitor browsers get stymied by default. How is a browser supposed to be non-niche when a popular password manager is refusing to support it, out of philosophical grounds?

How do I vote with my wallet here? Is $99 a month enough to compensate the developer who has to update the signing checks for the 1Password desktop extension? Can browser manufacturers pay this fee? Surely there's a good solution here.

ag_yaron

Hey guys, thanks for the followup and additional details.

You wrote that the Chromium based extension doesn't support autofill - what does that mean exactly? All the extension can do is save logins and autofill on websites. The classic extension can also save login and autofill websites, but it has not been updated or maintained for over two years now.
We do strongly urge everyone to use the new 1Password in the browser regardless of which browser you are using, as it provides a better autofilling experience and is being actively developed and constantly enhanced.
Here's how to utilize it to autofill and save logins: https://support.1password.com/getting-started-browser/

As for adding support for niche browsers - there's a lot more to it than just adding a line of code to support the code signature of that browser. We constantly audit the security of our supported browsers and the teams behind them, that's no simple task. We do not want the desktop app to establish a secure connection with any browser - that'll put your data in jeopardy, and this is not the first time we deny features that users want, so that we can maintain the highest security standards.

I completely understand where you're coming from, and will forward this request to the team, but I don't want to get anyone's hopes up.
Thanks again for the feedback here, much appreciated :)

ref: dev/projects/customer-feature-requests#863

hakusaro

@ag_yaron this is the behavior I see trying to autofill: https://streamable.com/rjo383

Note: yes, I did cancel the privacy dot com card, but I'm too lazy to re-record the video and hide the credit card. So, don't worry about that.

I would also say that the privacy card generation flow doesn't work either (pressing autofill does nothing).

With respect to the old vs new extension: last I checked, the Command + \ hotkey doesn't work so well with the 1Password X extension, and philosophically, I think it's more pure to use the old extension, since the new one is just implementing the entire 1Password experience, just like other password managers, inside the website window, below the fold. It's less ideal to me, philosophically, and less of a fun experience. Just my two cents though.

ag_yaron

Thanks for the screen recording @hakusaro ,

Does this issue occur on every website, or only on streamable.com? If it occurs on every website, then there's definitely something in that browser that doesn't play well with the extension, and I'll ask our devs to take a look at it.

As for your feedback here, you can make this new extension work more similarly to the old classic extension by disabling its inline menu in the extension's settings, that way it will not show up on its own inside/under fields. You can also adjust its keyboard shortcut in the settings page, but before we get to that, let's see if we can make it work in this browser.

Let me know if the issue in your video is unique to this website or to any/all websites.

hakusaro

@ag_yaron same behavior on all websites, as far as I can tell. I just picked a random site to test with.

The other thing that happens intermittently is that it takes an inordinate amount of time to login. That is to say, 1Password displays the loading spinner in the extension sometimes forever, but works on a new tab after a short delay.

Other Orion users also experience this problem, too, fwiw, but I don't think that it's been brought up too heavily.

ag_yaron

Thanks for the info @hakusaro .

I'll ask our developers to take a look and see if they can figure this out on our side of things.
As for the stuck loading screen, try right-clicking the extension's icon in the browser's toolbar -> Settings -> Turn off the "Integrate with 1Password app" option there.

the_lucifer

Hi, so I dived a bit into why it's not autofilling. There's two issues here:

1. The Desktop app seems to respond to the extension that the browser is not verified. (Same thing happens with the 1password classic extension). Screenshot from the extension logs is attached:

2. There's no way to reach 1Password's settings from the icon (This seems to be an Orion issue, right clicking and choosing Settings does nothing). Is there a direct url to visit 1Password extension settings?

anquieta

@ag_yaron I understand the push to use 1Password in the Browser. As a user of standalone, iCloud synced vaults, I would very much appreciate if the classic extension could be updated to whitelist Orion.

Either that or 1Password 7 follows through on using system-wide autofill that Apple introduced in Big Sur, per here: https://blog.1password.com/autofill-on-big-sur/

Thank you.

ag_yaron

Hey @the_lucifer ,

The desktop app won't connect to any browser that is not pre-approved by us, so that's out of the picture for now.
One of our devs have taken a quick look at Orion and saw it is a Safari web view with the extensions API implemented in it, so it is basically a big mesh of different pieces of software bundled up into a web view window.

1Password in the browser doesn't function correctly in it as there are functionalities missing in that browser that our extension utilizes. That might also be the case with the Classic extension if it were to connect to the desktop app in that browser.

So as of now, 1Password can't autofill in Orion, nor can you perform other actions such as getting to the extension's settings and more.

@anquieta , Firstly, I think you'll find this quite insightful regarding the future of local vaults: https://1password.community/discussion/comment/602340/#Comment_602340

And secondly, I don't think that the system-wide autofill that Apple introduced would work in other browsers but rather in other 3rd party apps that are not browsers. However, I hope I'm wrong and that would be indeed possible :)

hakusaro

One of our devs have taken a quick look at Orion and saw it is a Safari web view with the extensions API implemented in it, so it is basically a big mesh of different pieces of software bundled up into a web view window.

It's a custom build of WebKit. It would be technically incorrect to call it a WebView. By that same logic, Edge and Opera are just Chromium WebViews. Given that it's just WebKit with a lot of APIs that don't exist in Safari by default, again, it seems trivial to support, and the decision is arbitrary.

While it's interesting to speculate on whether or not the classic extension would or wouldn't work, the simplest thing would be to build the extension, permit the browser, and test it to see if it worked. Same with the modern extension for that matter.

I hope that 1Password reconsiders. Again, philosophically, making arbitrary decisions on which browsers to support significantly harms the already-diminishing open web.

piratx

Sometimes it's hard to believe there's a new browser to "rule em all". But this what is happening with Orion right now, the lightweight Safari became even lighter. Just try it for one day in your daily routine and check Activity Monitor to see its magic inside.
It's like it's never going to pass above 20% of cpu (depends on your hardware too though).. but while Safari has 100-150% with simple tasks, the same on Orion is only 10%.. and it's still on 0.99 alpha release.

1Password is one of the apps we "call" many times per day. With Orion I am back on using the mouse in my Mac :) Cause I need to have a shortcut like cmd \ that opens the 1password (mini) window and I search and drag n drop the credentials on my Orion browser for any site. I keep the ones that I want (and use) daily in Orion keychain BUT this is not why I am paying 1Password for.

I know it's not a browser that everyone knows. I know it's hard to develop that small detail into the old extension and make it compatible, but saving my passwords outside of 1Password, it's just doesn't feel right.

Maybe someone can push an alpha version for the "many" of us (https://daringfireball.net/2021/10/the_tragedy_of_safari_15_quote_unquote_tabs), that don't like the new Safari, and hate chrome and the Firefox memory hungry browsers?

I am using these ones for now:
https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/1password-x-password-manager/
https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/1password-–-password-mana/aeblfdkhhhdcdjpifhhbdiojplfjncoa

and I've tried beta as well, what is this for anyway?
https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/1password-beta-–-password/khgocmkkpikpnmmkgmdnfckapcdkgfaf?hl=en

Thanks in advance!

ag_yaron

Hey guys,

Some of our devs (and security team) are looking into this. Thank you for the additional details and feedback.

anquieta

Really appreciate it @ag_yaron. Wondering if there's an update on this.

ag_ana

Not yet @anquieta, sorry!

manplan23432

Would love to see 1password working properly with Orion Browser!

cowgod77

Just wanted to add my +1 hoping Orion support is added. The browser looks quite promising, but lack of functional 1Password makes it very hard to consider switching.

reykjalin

I just want to second this request and note that @hakusaro's experience here is the same one I've had, namely:

1. The 1Password X extension can't autofill on any websites; and
2. The 1Password X extension can sometimes take a really long time to load (1-3 mintues).

One of our devs have taken a quick look at Orion and saw it is a Safari web view with the extensions API implemented in it, so it is basically a big mesh of different pieces of software bundled up into a web view window.

@ag_yaron This is not correct. Orion runs a custom build of WebKit that includes support for the WebExtension API. To quote Orion's FAQ:

And extensions! Unlike Safari, Orion has native support for both Chrome and Firefox extensions. This gives our users access to the largest extensions ecosystem in the world. With Orion, you can one-click install your favorite extensions directly from the web.
[...]
How does Orion support extensions?
Early in development, we decided to natively support the Web Extensions API, the same API that Chrome and Firefox use to make their extension ecosystems so powerful. We had to port in hundreds of APIs, one by one, that were never meant to work with WebKit. Took us a few years, but here we are!

Orion currently supports about 70% of Web Extensions APIs, and we add more every day. On top of that, we built advanced security features that give our users granular control beyond what Chrome and Firefox offer. For example, you can choose to allow an extension to run only on certain websites.

As such Orion should be able to support the 1Password X extension, but the extension doesn't work as it's supposed to. From what anyone has been able to gather the problem does not seem to be with Orion's implementation of the WebExtension API, but instead because Orion is not approved by 1Password.

It'd be great if you could have your devs look into why the extension doesn't work as intended.

To recap

1. The 1Password browser extensions don't work in Orion.
2. The WebExtension APIs are supported in Orion — the same APIs used by Firefox and Chrome to run browser extensions.
3. The problem seems to be with the 1Password extensions, not lack of support for the APIs used by the 1Password browser extensions.

@ag_yaron and @ag_ana please ask your devs to take a closer look. Based on what everyone has seen adding support for Orion in an updated version of the browser extensions should not be a complicated matter. If that's not the case, please let us (or better yet the Orion team) know what has to be improved so 1Password can support Orion.

ag_ana

@reykjalin:

@ag_yaron and @ag_ana please ask your devs to take a closer look

Will do! :+1:

anquieta

@ag_ana Any update on this? As others have noted, it seems Orion just needs to be on 1Password's whitelist… Thank you!

ag_ana

No updates yet @anquieta, sorry!

Noffica

I would like to add my voice to support for Orion: X extension or the desktop one.

ag_ana

Noted, thank you @Noffica :+1:

quarkw

Thanks for the updates @ag_ana
I would also like to put in my support for Orion support for 1Password Desktop

ag_yaron

You got it @quarkw :+1:

nca

Another +1 here.
I tried orion rcently and I would love to use it regularly. I am waiting for 1password to deliver a working extension..

ag_ana

Noted @nca, thank you!

bnw

I've been using 1password since 2008. Please add Orion support—I use it because it's doubles my battery life while being compatible with Chrome extensions. So far 1password is the only extension not working with Orion.