Rich Icons Store With Database
One of the major benefits of this software is the visualization of logins with rich icons. Currently these icons are not stored in a password database. These databases are really folders which have most info encryted not including password titles. So why not add the rich icons (un-encrypted just as the titles are) to the database folder?
It is very misleading to show rich icons in screenshots throughout this website but to not store the images within your database and in fact (to my dismay) these icons do not even sync between devices! So when I go from 1password mac to 1password windows or android I DO NOT SEE any of the icons that I have customized.
Please improve icon support with:
-in database storage of icons
-cross platform icon syncing (would be taken care of if icons where stored in the database instead in application folders)
Comments
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Hi @Blake Blacksmith,
Thanks for taking the time to write to us :+1:
Your 1Password item icons can originate from one of the there sources:
- Our Rich Icons servers - 1Password fetches the icons questions and caches them locally for the device in question. They are not synced. You must enable Rich Icons on all you syncing devices.
- Software Licenses icons from your /Applications folder - If you have a software license item and the icon is question is not on our Rich Icons servers, 1Password will try to obtain the icon from the app itself - They are not synced either.
- Custom icons - If you manually add an icon to your item, this icon will be saved to the database and will also be synced over to your other devices.
It seems that you are having problems seeing the custom icons you added on you other syncing devices.
Can you please send us more details about which version of 1Password for Mac you are using and the version of OS X that you are currently on? It works fine here between 1Password 5 for Mac, 1Password 5 for iOS and 1Password 4 for Android.
Can you also send us some steps to reproduce? It will really help us track the bug down.
I look forward to your reply :smile:
Cheers!
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Yes I am taking about custom icons although I have to say the solution for Rich icons is a bit messy. I would rather see all icons stored in the database then to have to re-download all icons every time I go to another device. Please reconsider storing ALL icons in the database. I can't be alone in thinking this is a poor solution for icons.
As far as custom icons I am using the most updated versions of Mac, Windows, and Android (all pro verisons synced with dropbox).
Currently I have made 5+ keys with custom icons on my Mac but when I go to Windows or Android apps the icons are replaced with the rich icons or are absent altogether.
Also in both windows and android when I view a list of keys the icons are NOT shown but when I view the details of a single key the icon is shown.
Thanks for your help.
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Hi @Blake Blacksmith,
Thanks for getting back to us :smiley:
The Custom Icons you add in 1Password for Mac should be visible in 1Password 4 for Windows too. Can you please confirm that this works fine? If you have custom icons issues between 1Password for Mac and Windows, can you please send us detailed steps to reproduce so we can determine on which side the bug is?
However, 1Password for Android doesn't support Custom Icons yet. We are working on them. They should come soon :smile:
The reason why we do not sync Rich Icons is mainly because image files are large by definition:
- Sync will take longer and will use more bandwidth especially on those precious LTE connections on mobile devices.
- Flash storage is quite hard to come by on a mobile device. Some users might opt to disable Rich Icons altogether to save disk space.
Please let me know if this helps.
Thanks!
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Custom Icons you add in 1Password for Mac Mac should be visible in 1Password 4 for Windows too. Can you please confirm that this works fine?
This does NOT work but the reverse (custom in windows to mac) works.
can you please send us detailed steps to reproduce so we can determine on which side the bug is
I added a custom (png-base) icons to a few keys using the Mac version, let dropbox sync the 1password database, and then opened the database in windows to find that my icons did not carry over to windows and that only the rich-automatically grabbed icons are available.
1Password for Android doesn't support Custom Icons yet. We are working on them. They should come soon :smile:
This should be mentioned when someone purchases the Pro android version since icons are a key feature.
Are icons supported in iOS? (I have not tried but am just curious)As for reasons to not sync rich icons I would argue that even 1000 icons (meaning 1000 keys which is very excessive) at 1Mb(a high quality icon) still only cost 1Gb of storage. I do not see that as an issue on a Mac or Windows but it would be an issue on Androids/iOS where 8-16GB is typical. The size issue can be circumvented by reducing the size of large icon images when a user sets a new icon to a size that is more manageable like 256kb which is a good size for small icons anyway and would result in 0.256 Gb of storage for the mentioned example. Regardless of whether you automatically resize new icons or not there should be an option (if not the default) that all icons are stored within your database. I should not have to re-download icons for my passwords every time i move my database to a new device.
While we are talking I wanted to ask a question about 1password databases. Why is it that I can open the database (why is it a folder and not a single file)? Also, why is it that I can read quite alot of the information within this file like name of my passwords(the database is not fully encrypted)? These seem like fundamental design issues that would make my passwords more easy to locate and extract by hackers & malware.
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Rad's a pretty busy guy on our development team and I have a bit more time on my hands so I offered to take over for him on this, hope you don't mind.
I was not able to recreate the situation in which you are describing. This isn't to say it isn't happening but what I'd love from you is a step by step process for what you are doing and what is happening so that we can try to recreate the scenario you are seeing with custom icons not syncing.
What I was able to recreate is described as #2 in Rad's original list. Basically I have an app on my computer that does not have an icon on our Rich Icon server (Spillo.app). I can create a new Software License, type in "Spillo" for the title and save it. The icon is displayed. In this situation the icon is not coming from our Rich Icon server and it's not a custom icon, it is actually coming from the Application in the Applications folder. This icon does not sync, as Rad suggested above. On Windows, anytime you set an icon at all it's considered a custom icon, so there's a bit less confusion. That said, Windows isn't also trying to use Applications icons either so that is a nicety we are trying to do on Mac. I've also filed an improvement report for this, I'm not sure what will happen but I do hope we can discuss it and see what kind of ideas we can come up with.
That's the only way I have been able to have an icon visible on the Mac but not see it on Windows. In all other cases they display fine. This is why I am curious about the steps you're taking so that we can try to figure out what is happening and possibly find a solution for you.
To reiterate what Rad said, the reason we do not store all of the icons in the synced keychain is due to file size, among other things. We have a few things we need to be aware of.
Users may be on mobile broadband and very few people have unlimited data, we need to make sure we are being conscious of this situation and courteous to these users and not forcing them to go over their data plan allotments.
Storage requirements can be quite limited as well. There was a lot of discussion around iOS 8 release that a reasonable percentage of users were not able to upgrade due to the space requirements to download the update, decompress it and then install it. While you personally may not have an issue with icons taking up space others may not be okay with it. I'm in your boat though, I generally purchase more storage space than I need but it sounds like you and I are technologically savvy enough to do that. 1Password is used by both technologically savvy people like us, but also by people who do not know how any of this works and we need to be conscious of this as well.
Storage requirements also apply to Dropbox and iCloud. I would argue a very large majority of people are using the free plan for these services. I have no proof of this but my gut tells me that a pretty large number of users probably aren't paying for more space. While I think iCloud and Dropbox would love us for including more in the sync file, thus increasing space, our users may not be as happy about the extra costs they may have as a result :)
Sync speed is yet another thing we need to be aware of. A user most certainly wants sync to be fast and the least amount of data we sync the faster it's going to be. Users expect sync to be quick and arguably, with Dropbox at the moment it isn't very fast as is due to the fact we have so many files involved with AgileKeychain.
I'd be happy to pass your request along to sync all of the data, but I hope that with the above information you can see why we do not sync icons with the sync files. Just because we are syncing a lot of files in AgileKeychain doesn't mean we want to sync more :)
To answer your other questions. 1Password's "agilekeychain" format is what is called a "bundle" on OS X. We register the .agilekeychain extension and any folder that ends in a .agilekeychain will be turned into a bundle as a result. This makes things far easier on OS X from a user's perspective because we can do what we need to do with the files in the folder and to the user it all appears as a single file. Bundles are very common on OS X. They hide complexity when it isn't needed. In fact, all applications are bundles. OS X treats any folder that ends in .app as an application.
As for the design of the format, you can read more about it here:
AgileKeychain: https://help.agilebits.com/1Password3/agile_keychain_design.html
CloudKeychain: https://learn2.agilebits.com/1Password4/Security/keychain-design.html
And some other major documents for 1Password 4 (and 5 since they are fundamentally the same) can be found here: https://learn2.agilebits.com/1Password4/Security/
AgileKeychain was designed in a different time, CloudKeychain encrypts everything except some minor meta data which is what you probably want. However, CloudKeychain is only currently supported in Mac, Windows and iOS. This leaves our Android users out at the moment. We'll hopefully find a transition to CloudKeychain happening in the future but I certainly cannot provide a timeframe for that. It turns out it's very hard to migrate millions of users which a variety of different needs and requirements. :) When we have more to say about a transition there we'll let you know here on the forum and our blog, and likely our newsletter.
I hope that helps answer your questions and gives a better idea of why we chose to do things the way we do. While I'm happy to pass your feedback along, I wouldn't expect it to change anytime soon, if at all. Nothing is ever set in stone here at AgileBits but we do want to do the right thing for the most number of users we can and the above limitations are pretty crucial things that we feel we need to do right. I think for your icon situation is that we should probably just unify how we treat application icons in app, assuming that's what you're seeing :)
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Hi there.
I do not know how much clearer I can state the issue please indicate what more information you would like. As I have said:
I added a custom (png-base) icons to a few keys using the Mac version, let dropbox sync the 1password database, and then opened the database in windows to find that my icons did not carry over to windows and that only the rich-automatically grabbed icons are available.
What I was able to recreate is described as #2 in Rad's original list. Basically I have an app on my computer that does not have an icon on our Rich Icon server (Spillo.app). I can create a new Software License, type in "Spillo" for the title and save it. The icon is displayed. In this situation the icon is not coming from our Rich Icon server and it's not a custom icon, it is actually coming from the Application in the Applications folder. This icon does not sync, as Rad suggested above.
This is not the same as what I am talking about.
On Windows, anytime you set an icon at all it's considered a custom icon, so there's a bit less confusion. That said, Windows isn't also trying to use Applications icons either so that is a nicety we are trying to do on Mac.
For the cost of this software I expected a well functioning app but to be honest this software has a great deal of issues left to hash out. Why would you guys ever use icons that would not sync to your other platforms?
On that same note what is your return policy I've had the app for less than a week and am fully regretting my purchase?
To reiterate what Rad said, the reason we do not store all of the icons in the synced keychain is due to file size, among other things. We have a few things we need to be aware of.
Not to sound rude but I understand that and Rad already mentioned these limitations. As a means of working around them I had suggested having a user option to always save and sync your icons to within the database.
I appreciate your great responses but really dislike the direction you guys are taking with respect to icons and database format. Thanks for your time.
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We're sorry you feel that way but of course each person needs to find software that fits with their requirements. Just because you asked and I didn't spot an answer, custom icons in the iOS version are supported.
You mentioned Macs, Windows and Android. On the assumption that you purchased our Mac + Windows bundle directly from you have a 30 day window for refunds. I'm not an Android user so I don't feel confident reporting on the Google Play policy. What I do know is it would have to be via Google, much like if you had purchased the Mac App Store or iOS version of 1Password you would have to contact Apple.
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