iOS 11 Wifi/WLAN Sync Not Working
I am using 1Password with a standalone, local vault. No subscription/account.
Since upgrading to iOS 11 my 1P Wifi/WLAN sync has been very finicky. It doesn't want to see the WLAN server on the network (a Windows 10 PC connected via Ethernet). What I saw when I first installed iOS 11.0.0 was that the wifi sync wouldn't see the WLAN server at first, but EVENTUALLY it would show up and finally sync after several long minutes. When I disable the WLAN server, it'd continue to show the machine as on the network even when it was no longer enabled (though it would stop showing it was a Windows server and just show the server name alone with no operating system icon next to the name). Again, EVENTUALLY things would update and the machine would go away. It was like some sort of aggressive caching issue or something.
Since upgrading to iOS 11.0.2 this problem has gotten exponentially worse. I literally had time to search out if anyone else had reported this problem, dig through the discussion forums, spend some time typing up this entry, etc. About a solid FIFTEEN MINUTES later, minimum, the Windows PC FINALLY showed up as a WLAN server and I was able to sync. Note that the Windows PC HAS NOT CHANGED AT ALL. Same software it was running before I upgraded my iPhone, so the Windows PC cannot be the problem; this problem started with the iOS 11 upgrade. This is something with 1P on iOS 11. The iPhone is on my wifi network just fine, as far as I can tell. I can even run SpeedTest on it and I don't see bad latency or dropped packets or anything.
I have tried removing 1P on the iPhone, rebooting the phone (to clear any 1P app data), and re-installing 1P from the iOS App Store to just start over, like maybe something got glitched with the app or its data during the iOS upgrade, but nope, even as a fresh install with fresh data, it still takes forever to finally see the WLAN server. It does.. eventually.. and does sync. It just takes forever to see it and finally do it. Once the sync actually occurs, that part is very fast.
To me this feels like caching. Especially the way where, after it's finally seen the WLAN server, I can turn that server OFF and 1P continues to show it anyway. Even when I'm in the Set up Sync and hit the Refresh button! I press the button, 1P clears the list of servers and refreshes, and the server pops right back up even though I turned off WLAN Server on it! It just shows up as the server name without the OS icon displayed, whereas if the WLAN server is actually running it'll show the Windows OS icon next to the server name. This is the only difference I visibly see when iOS 1P is in this delayed state.
1Password Version: 6.9 (690008)
Extension Version: Not Provided
OS Version: iOS 11.0.2
Sync Type: WLAN
Comments
-
Hi @Mousit,
Thanks for taking the time to write in. That is a bit strange, as iOS 11 has been out for a little while now, and this is the first report I’ve seen of difficulty using the WLAN server in combination with iOS 11.
Please try running through all of the steps in this guide (if one of them resolves the issue, stop):
If you're having trouble using the WLAN server
I understand you’re fairly confident that the issue is not related to the Windows PC, or the network, as nothing has changed there, but I’d ask that you follow all of the steps regardless. The steps are there because they’ve helped resolve an issue for a customer even when the problem seemed to be unrelated.
Please let me know what you’re able to find.
Ben
0 -
Hello @Ben
I did most of these steps. I can't do ALL of them because the Windows PC is a desktop with a wired Ethernet connection, no wifi in it at all. So I can't do some of the wifi steps nor do the ad-hoc network steps. I did check the WLAN Server settings in 1P, checked the firewall, rebooted the home gateway, reconnected the iPhone, etc. All those steps. No effect. Still as slow as ever.
What I'm doing on the iPhone to watch this is I go to Settings > Sync > Change WLAN Server and choose Disable when it pops up asking me to turn off sync so I can pick a new server. After that it takes me to the little screen where it lists available WLAN servers, that very basic screen with the Refresh button. This is where I can sit and watch it and see how very long it takes before it finally notices the Windows server is there. I can press the Refresh button and the server still doesn't show up, until a long time later. It does vary greatly, however. I've seen the server pop up as quick as 60 seconds, and sometimes it takes 15 minutes. Which is why I got on the thought about caching or something like it.
Likewise, after I've gotten it to see the Windows server and sync with it, I turn the WLAN server OFF on the Windows machine, and I can go to that screen on the iPhone and the Windows server still shows up in the picklist. I can hit refresh, and it'll clear the screen and a few seconds later the Windows server will show up again. Obviously if I try to actually CHOOSE it I'll get an error after a delay, telling me the sync couldn't be completed because the operation timed out (makes sense, when the server isn't running!).
I don't really have anything else on the iPhone that does syncing (I have most notifications, push updates, etc turned off everywhere), so it's tough to tell if other apps have an issue like this. I HAVE noticed that the iOS App Store, when there are Updates available, it's slow to actually show them. Sometimes I can force a refresh of the Updates screen and more pop up. 10 seconds later I can force a refresh again and MORE app updates pop up. I don't have that many apps so I can't imagine new updates are coming that fast. I feel pretty sure all those updates were available when I performed the first refresh, but it didn't show them all until I forced a few more refreshes. Seems more like the App Store application just.. isn't processing them all at once. I have no idea if that's in any way related to the stuff I see with 1P or not, it's just something I noticed and strikes me as weird (since it didn't do this in iOS 10). I feel like maybe I could have an underlying issue with my iOS 11 upgrade and how it's processing network updates. Of course, fixing that would probably require a total wipe of the whole phone and I just.. would rather live with a 15 minute 1P sync than deal with THAT.
0 -
@Mousit: Thanks for all of these details. That is really weird. I'm not sure I'd assume they're related, but it is interesting that you're having trouble with the App Store updates as well. I've had that problem for years, but it did seem worst in iOS 9 and 10 — no change for me in iOS 11. But I doubt this is related because that should be going out over the internet and not relying on local discover using Apple's Bonjour, which WLAN Server does depend on. I and others have had tons of trouble with Bonjour in recent years due to the mdnsresponder/discoveryd debacle (which has improved — but not fixed — largely by Apple reverting to the former). But, like Ben, this is the first news I've heard on this front recently.
Unfortunately since we're relying on Apple's discovery service here there isn't much we can do. As you noted, 1Password hasn't changed in this regard, and it sounds like the only new element is iOS 11. There are a few things I would try in your situation, but please take this with a grain of salt because 1) I do not represent Apple and 2) you may ultimately need their assistance to resolve this.
That said, since we know there are two parts to this equation for sure, I'd start with reinstalling Bonjour services on the PC. I have never had to do this in the past, but it's literally the only thing (along with reinstalling the network adapter) outside of the troubleshooting guide Ben linked on the PC side which I could imagine making any difference (that guide is really thorough and I actually wrote most of it myself from my experiences helping customers with sync).
The second thing is, obviously, the iOS device. If you upgraded from iOS 10, or restored from a backup when setting up a new device, it is not uncommon for settings migration to mess up. And since we're dealing with what's ostensibly a network issue, iOS Settings > General > Reset > Reset Network Settings may be your only hope there, short of device reset or Apple magic. My hesitation is that it can really suck to have to re-setup Wi-Fi networks, cellular, etc. afterward — but I may just hate that because I've got an odd setup for my cell carrier. For you, it may be less of a hassle, and I've had Apple staff recommend this to me in the past for other connection issues, and it has helped.
My final concern here is that, again, we just don't have any insight into what's going wrong at the hardware or (more likely) the OS level here that's causing this issue for you. Bonjour does have known caching issues (probably not safe for work), which haven't gone away entirely even with the changes Apple has made.
I'm glad that you're able to sync eventually, but I wouldn't wish this kind of experience on anyone. And as a final note, I'd encourage you to stop disabling/re-enabling WLAN Server, as that destroys the sync state and could lead to sync conflicts. I'm sorry I don't have a real solution to offer you, just some scattered ideas and insights from my own experience with Bonjour, but please let me know if you have any questions, or anything else you discover (no pun intended... :( )
0 -
Hi @brenty
Thanks, I'd forgotten about that particular clear option. I may give the Reset Network Settings a try later on (I'm about to leave on a vacation and I don't want to mess that up right before I leave :).
I didn't know that you use Bonjour for the discovery; I had assumed you just used something internal to your application to ping for a WLAN server from the iOS device. That makes more sense to me, that there could be a Bonjour/discovery issue on my iPhone since the iOS upgrade.
Also I had forgotten, but you reminded me just now or I would've mentioned it earlier. There was one, ONE time I got a weird error message, that I've not been able to repeat since and didn't get a capture of it unfortunately. It was when I was playing with the whole turning the WLAN server on and off on the Windows machine and watching the iPhone continue to show it in the available servers list. One time I selected the server (while it was actually off and shouldn't have been showing up) on the iPhone and tried to sync, and I got this error message that looked like system calls. It told me something along the lines of _kXXXXX: Discovery failed and a few other _kXXXXX messages. I can't remember the XXXXX part but they looked like system or API calls. I remember the _k prefix on them. I've never been able to cause this message to happen again. Am I off my rocker or are there _k calls like that, do you know? I'm not a programmer or anything but from what I know of iOS and OS X calls Apple likes using underscored prefixes like that, which would suuuuure put me back on the line of thinking that there's an underlying mess with my iOS 11 upgrade.
0 -
I’m not really sure what the
_kbit might refer to, to be honest. I still have yet to see any other reports of issues with WLAN sync though, so I’m still leaning toward this being an issue with your particular setup, vs a general iOS 11 / 1Password issue.Enjoy your vacation. Please let us know what you’re able to find when you return. :)
Ben
0 -
@Mousit: Just to confirm, I've never seen an error like that either, so maybe that's something new in iOS 11 that I have yet to experience. I'm sorry I don't have a clear solution for you, but I'm glad you found my ramblings on this subject helpful! I hope you have an awesome vacation (probably not going to have to deal with this issue for a bit at least!) and we're here whenever you're back. :chuffed:
0 -
I performed the Network Settings Reset but unfortunately that doesn't seem to have made any difference. It still takes just as long for the WLAN server to show up for syncing on the iPhone. I also set up 1Password on a second machine--a MacBook Pro running High Sierra--and, yep you guessed it, that one takes forever and a day before the iPhone notices it too. Eventually it will notice them and I can sync between them (swapping the sync setting on the iPhone to sync with one or the other). So other than taking 1 to 15 minutes to notice a server is there, the syncing DOES consistently work.
That does at least point rather firmly that the iPhone is the problem, not the Windows desktop, since I'm seeing the same kind of delay with the OS X machine too. The OS X machine is running 6.8.3 while the Windows machine runs 4.6.2.626 (since I use standalone vaults).
I'm out of ideas for what to try, short of completely wiping the iPhone and starting from scratch, which I really, really don't want to do. Plus I'm not convinced it'll fix the problem if there's a deeper upgrade issue that messed up Bonjour/discoveryd. That might not be fixable with a user data wipe.
I rarely need to change the data in my vault (I don't go creating and deleting accounts much after all), so I don't actually sync often, just when I need to propagate updates. I will probably just live with this problem and hope that an iOS update might one day fix it.
0 -
@Mousit: Thanks for the followup! Short of reinstalling the OS, there isn't much else you can do on the iPhone. But the fact that you're having the same issue with another Mac* as well leads me to think it's something with the network itself, since we've all but eliminated individual devices as being the culprit. I couldn't even tell you what might be wrong there.
When I've seen network issues, they tend to result in Bonjour discovery being blocked completely rather than simply slowed down to a crawl. However, one thing this reminds me of are the issues that were worse back on Yosemite due to discoveryd. While it is still occasionally necessary with mdnsresponder, I was having shot down everything at least once a week for a while there to clear the Bonjour cache and prevent other devices from dumping stale data back into the network after rebooting the router.
I'm out of ideas for what to try, short of completely wiping the iPhone and starting from scratch, which I really, really don't want to do. Plus I'm not convinced it'll fix the problem if there's a deeper upgrade issue that messed up Bonjour/discoveryd. That might not be fixable with a user data wipe.
I concur. I wouldn't want to do that either, and I strongly suspect that it won't make a difference anyway.
I rarely need to change the data in my vault (I don't go creating and deleting accounts much after all), so I don't actually sync often, just when I need to propagate updates. I will probably just live with this problem and hope that an iOS update might one day fix it.
I hear you. Definitely try shutting everything — and I mean everything — down for a few minutes. After that, go with just the router, computer, and iPhone, and see if you see any improvement. If so, you bring other devices back online and see if they're contributing to the problem (probably not), or if it's just getting worse over time and fixed with a full network restart.
*While you're probably just doing this for troubleshooting purposes, keep in mind that switching between multiple computers to sync via WLAN Server is strongly discouraged, as it can cause a number of issues. WLAN Server is designed to work between a single computer and one or more mobile devices, and any time you "pair" with a new computer you're destroying the sync state, which could lead to conflicts.
0 -
I've tried restarting my network equipment before but I'll give that a go again with turning everything off. You know something did occur to me with that, speaking of discoveryd and all. iOS 11 coincided (well, less than a week) with iTunes 12.7 release (let's not even start on that App Store debacle..), which I assume would've changed Bonjour with it. I'm guessing anyway. Do you know if Bonjour saw an update with that? 12.7 updated Windows and OS X. I can't remember if I synced my 1P vault in the span between when iTunes 12.7 released and iOS 11 released. I doubt I did since it doesn't change often. Maybe something in there. Though my MBP was updated with a wipe-and-clean-install of High Sierra, not an upgrade-in-place, so you'd think Bonjour would be clean there. That feels like chasing down a rabbit hole so perhaps maybe I won't go there.
On a bit of a tangent, since you've mentioned the risks of swapping WLAN around like I'm doing. Is there a recommended way for syncing offline, standalone vaults between systems? I don't use Dropbox or iCloud or anything, I keep my vault offline and restricted to my LAN. I'd prefer to keep it that way, which is why I've not explored using any online syncs. I got into the habit a long time back of using WLAN and swapping it between systems, because at the time there were issues with 1pif files between Windows and Mac. They didn't import correctly, or sometimes just flat wouldn't work at all. This was of course years and years ago (before the opvault format, even; that was probably 1Password 3 or even 2), and I even made bug reports at the time, but that was before this Discussion Forum. I haven't tried using 1pif since, as WLAN had been working great for me until iOS 11, through a multitude of replaced Windows, OS X, and iOS devices, so I've not had any need to explore other options.
It always disappointed me that WLAN only works between desktop and iOS. I've always wanted to see WLAN talk between Windows and OS X, and I think I've even made this feature request in the past, as have others.
It's been so long since I've changed my ways, probably wouldn't hurt to explore available options with current the 1P versions. I didn't even know until recently that 1P iOS could import vault backups by dropping a backup file into the App Data (I think it's called File Sharing in 12.7 now) area of iTunes. So that's new to me!
Do you have any recommendations for how I would sync Windows, Mac, and iOS in an offline (well, LAN-restricted), standalone way? Or is that maybe something that'll come along with the big 1Password 7 change, when Windows and Mac get back in version sync, and other kinds of sync? :) Thanks!
0 -
Hi @Mousit!
Hope you had a good vacation. :)
Do you know if Bonjour saw an update with that?
I don’t know that.
not an upgrade-in-place, so you'd think Bonjour would be clean there
Hmm. Yes, I’d agree with that, though I couldn’t say for sure.
Sorry I have few definite answers in this regard. What I do know for sure is that while at this point we have certainly seen some customers experiencing difficulties with 1Password + iOS 11 + High Sierra + WLAN Sync, the volume hasn’t been any more than normal, and as far as I’m aware there hasn’t been any specific issue tied to any updates (just the normal routine stuff we deal with with wireless networks and WLAN sync).
Is there a recommended way for syncing offline, standalone vaults between systems?
There is not. It is possible to use a combination of WLAN Sync + Folder Sync alongside a 3rd party utility to sync the data from Folder Sync between computers, but this would not be a supported / “recommended” solution. While there are all kinds of things that “should work” we just don’t have the resources to test them, and as such can’t put our stamp of approval behind them or spend technical support time troubleshooting them.
It always disappointed me that WLAN only works between desktop and iOS. I've always wanted to see WLAN talk between Windows and OS X, and I think I've even made this feature request in the past, as have others.
Understood, and while we can certainly understand the desire for that, we also have to be realistic about our roadmap. Further development of WLAN Sync isn’t part of it.
Do you have any recommendations for how I would sync Windows, Mac, and iOS in an offline (well, LAN-restricted), standalone way
While we very rarely say “never” I think it is fairly unlikely that we’ll see something like that. We do plan to continue support of local vaults with 1Password 7 for Windows I’m not aware of any new sync options coming with that. Our recommendation for someone looking to sync various devices across various platforms would be 1Password membership. I realize that means stepping outside your defined requirements (LAN restricted) but we’ve taken a number of steps to make 1Password.com very secure, namely by never having access to your data (have you read our security design white paper?).
Ben
0 -
@Mousit: I haven't used it for years, but I know a number of folks here in the forums have said they use ChronoSync to sync 1Password data between multiple computers, with one of those acting as the WLAN Server for syncing with mobile devices. Maybe be worth looking into, but honestly with the security and convenience of 1Password.com nowadays WLAN Server comes up less and less — which I guess is why this discussion interests me so much. :chuffed:
You know something did occur to me with that, speaking of discoveryd and all. iOS 11 coincided (well, less than a week) with iTunes 12.7 release (let's not even start on that App Store debacle..), which I assume would've changed Bonjour with it. I'm guessing anyway. Do you know if Bonjour saw an update with that? 12.7 updated Windows and OS X. I can't remember if I synced my 1P vault in the span between when iTunes 12.7 released and iOS 11 released. I doubt I did since it doesn't change often. Maybe something in there. Though my MBP was updated with a wipe-and-clean-install of High Sierra, not an upgrade-in-place, so you'd think Bonjour would be clean there. That feels like chasing down a rabbit hole so perhaps maybe I won't go there.
I can't say with 100% certainly, but I don't think any of that will make a difference. Bonjour, as far as I'm aware, is part of the OS on Macs, and quite separate from iTunes. For example, mdnsresponder was used for years, Apple introduced discoveryd with macOS 10.10 Yosemite, and then went back to mdnsresponder with the 10.10.4 update. So it appears to only change with an OS update, and only rarely at that (though there are bug fixes in point releases notes here and there). On Windows, it's a separate install, part of the Bonjour Print Services package, so again, separate from iTunes. And in both cases WLAN Server (and printing) work without iTunes installed. That said, I don't know much about it on iOS. Clearly it's built into iOS, but it's pretty opaque there, given how little we see what's going on under the hood.
Definitely let me know if my previous suggestion helps. I'm hopeful, because I've had luck with that myself — and frankly I'm out of ideas! :dizzy:
0 -
Just figured I'd give an update. It's back to working normally. I kind of did a bit of everything when I had a free day to make a mess and play with everything. Cleared the cache off the Windows and OS X machines (reinstalled Bonjour services on Win10). Updated iOS on the iPhone. Settings reset. There was also a firmware update for my home router, so not only did I restart it (which I'd done before), but I went ahead and did a full reset on it after the firmware update and just restored its settings.
Not sure what part of all that was what finally took care of things, but 1P on my iPhone is back to seeing the WLAN servers immediately as soon as they start up, no delays. So, whatever it was, things are okay again. :)
0 -
It's a Halloween miracle! My money would be on the router (daemon possessed, perhaps), but we may never know. Thanks so much for the update! While I hate not knowing for sure what was wrong and what helped, I'm happy at least that all is well for you again. Cheers! :)
0 -
I'll let the people decide. ;)
0
