Shortcomings on the Windows version of 1Password compared to the OS X version
I have noticed that the Windows version is not as easy to use and fluid as the OS X version.
Specifically, I am talking about the helper app you get within a browser. On OS X I can scroll through the HUGE list of websites that I have in 1Password by using the scroll wheel.
On Windows, you just can't do that. You have to click the down or up arrow on the list to go through all the sites you have. That is a pain in the butt.
Then, if you need to just copy the password off of it for some reason, you have to right click on it, have the list open again, have to click the arrow all over again to get back to where you wanted, and then hover over the entry to copy the password from there.
On OS X you just hover over the entry and the information pops up for you to copy very quickly and easily. It is just a horrible UI experience.
It is often much much easier to just use the standard 1Password app to find what you need quickly and easily. I would rather be able to do what I am used to in OS X when I am trying to do this stuff. Is there no way you guys can fix it where the UI works exactly the same on both platforms to make it easier to use????
Oh, something else I just remembered, sometimes my information doesn't sync as fast as I would think it should through Dropbox. I can make changes on something or add another site and want to use it on another machine only to find it isn't updated yet. Is there any way to make it update instantaneously across platforms? Or what do you have to do to force an update to get everything on the same page??
Thanks.
1Password Version: 4.6.0.598
Extension Version: 4.5.2.90
OS Version: Windows 10
Sync Type: Dropbox
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Hi @steveken, I'm not with AgileBits but I do know they are working on a new Windows version that will not only support 1Password for Teams like the current one doesn't, but I'm guessing will likely address some of the differences they have between the Windows and Mac versions. I'm primarily a Windows user and while it works pretty well, it does stutter sometimes on my larger vault and things are a little outdated in some of the graphical interface. AgileBits developed 1Password on the Mac first, and it's still nicer there (a different team works on the Windows version as well). I haven't had any major issues with scrolling in the Windows app, but there is a Help->Advanced->Tune 1Password for maximum performance option that disables rich icons (they slow the list view down) and some other features that help the list display be a bit snappier.
As far as the Dropbox sync, on Windows, the vault is loaded directly from the Dropbox files synchronized to the file system, so as soon as a change is made Dropbox should save the change to your Dropbox online and sync with the rest of the computers in your account shortly. Mac (and I assume iOS) versions of the app keep a separate internal database with your vault and keep the Dropbox files synchronized continuously. I've not noticed any measurable delay myself with the Dropbox and Mac versions being out of sync, and as long as Dropbox itself shows its own sync is "up to date" I see the same info on both platforms immediately.
I assume some of the Windows sluggishness is due to using the Dropbox file system directly on Windows but having an internal database with faster searchability on the Mac version. I have no idea if Windows will have its own local database eventually, but I would definitely like to see it myself to gain some performance (I have over 1100 items total) :-)
AgileBits employees may have something else to add, that's just my two (or three) cents...
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Yeah, I know they are working on a new version. The only problem I have with that is if they want to try to charge for the Windows 10 version. I've already paid quite a bit for the Windows, Mac, iOS, and Android versions of the app. Kinda hoping the need to put out more money doesn't continue. If it does, I might just have to call it quits on updating the Windows version and just look up stuff on my iPhone or Mac which are often just feet away while using the Windows version anyway, so it wouldn't be that big of a deal.
I don't have problems with it stuttering at all. When going through my large vault of logins on the Windows web browser extension, one can't simply scroll their wheel on the mouse to look through the rest of the vault. It works fine on the main 1Password app itself. It's just the extension. On the Windows browser extensions, you have to use the arrows at the top or bottom of the list of sites to be able to get it to scroll through them. It just makes it very clunky to use. And like I said in the original post, if you wanna see the user or pass on an entry, you can't just hover on it like on OS X with the Windows browser extension. You have to right click on it, then scroll all the way back to where you were again to be able to see it. That makes it VERY aggravating to use. I think I have posted a pic pointing at the arrow things I was talking about on the browser vault list. I tried to gray out the logins, too. LOL Hope it worked. :)
Maybe I am just missing something on it. I dunno. That's just how I see it right now.
As far as Dropbox, maybe something isn't updating as quickly as they should be then. I have had quite a number of times when things aren't in sync across 1Password versions and it just kinda bugs me. Maybe I need to see if there is something I am doing wrong with it. Can't imagine what. Maybe I should use a different cloud syncing solution, too. Don't know if any other ways would provide as quick of a sync across platforms as Dropbox should.
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Hi guys,
Is there no way you guys can fix it where the UI works exactly the same on both platforms to make it easier to use????
As much as we want to reuse the same UI and code from OS X, we sadly cannot. However, this isn't entirely a Windows issue, we are working as fast as we can to address the issues you've mentioned. It will be different in the future but we don't release details about our future plans until the code is ready first.
The only problem I have with that is if they want to try to charge for the Windows 10 version.
We do understand the costs of using 1Password and not to mention the confusion between two completely different Windows programs and would we charge for both separately? We will release more details about this as things will change when we release 1Password for Team service, which is a subscription model with all apps included for free.
One thing to keep in mind is 1Password 6 for Mac and iOS were just released last week as free upgrades to current customers, which means there's a good chance the next Windows version will as well but it is too soon to confirm anything. As I said, more details are forthcoming.
When going through my large vault of logins on the Windows web browser extension, one can't simply scroll their wheel on the mouse to look through the rest of the vault.
There is no UI in the browser extension, you're seeing the native UI generated by 1Password Helper running on your PC that communicates with your browser extensions. Due to the UI design that's menu based, the current menu structure doesn't have the option to enable scrolling, which was news to us when we finished building it.
We do plan to fix this in the future by redesigning it again to make sure scrolling is enabled, along with inline search support and other features we want to add to 1Password Helper to make it identical to 1Password Mini on OS X.
You have to right click on it, then scroll all the way back to where you were again to be able to see it.
Yep, it has to do with the design we're using. This will be changed to make it more intuitive. What you're seeing is 1Password generating a brand new menu with the decrypted content and putting it on top of the existing menu, it is not connected to the previous menu. That's why you have to do a right-click to generate that menu with the decrypted content. We want to do what 1Password mini on OS X does, generate a submenu automatically when you hover over it but it turns out it is not that easy. We will fix this.
For now, what you can do is search as you type. As soon as you open the 1Password Helper, type what you want to use, and 1Password will narrow it down for you. As you might tell from this, as soon as you stopped typing, 1Password will generate a new menu with the found items. It is not a very good experience but we are working on these things.
As far as Dropbox, maybe something isn't updating as quickly as they should be then. I have had quite a number of times when things aren't in sync across 1Password versions and it just kinda bugs me. Maybe I need to see if there is something I am doing wrong with it. Can't imagine what. Maybe I should use a different cloud syncing solution, too. Don't know if any other ways would provide as quick of a sync across platforms as Dropbox should.
Dropbox is the only sync solution you can use between Mac, Windows and iOS. It should be relatively quick but it does have limits in how much changes it can push per hour in order to ensure everyone can sync at the same time.
However, there could be bugs in detecting for new changes. If you see this again when the Windows program doesn't show the changes you expect and Dropbox says it is up to date, try to lock the program and unlock it, does it make the new data show up? Let us know, it might be the case of something's interfering with 1Password on the PC.
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Mike,
Wow, thanks for the thorough response! I really appreciate it!
While I don't use the team stuff you guys have recently implemented (and probably a lot of other cool stuff, lol), I do realize that the latest updates for OS X and iOS were free like you said. It kinda makes sense that it could continue to go along that path. I won't expect anything, however, and will see how things are when it is done.
I completely understand now the problems with the scrolling on the Windows version. It makes complete sense now. I guess I didn't think about it from a programming point of view. I can see how stuff like that would crop up. I hope you are able to figure out a way around it. It's just aggravating the way it is now. :)
I will work on trying out a few things the next time I am not seeing changes propagated between versions. I did have a problem just now with it not recognizing my login info for here, but I realized it was because Dropbox had been shut down for some reason on this machine. Once I started it back up, everything was there as should be. It is probably just user error on me the other times I am seeing it. LOL
Again, thanks for responding so well. I know you really didn't have to. It makes me feel good knowing you were willing to. I think my concerns have now been answered. :) Have a great evening!
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Hi @steveken,
You're welcome, thanks for understanding.
As for Dropbox, if you upgraded to Windows 10 rather installing Windows 10 as a clean install, I would recommend reinstalling Dropbox. We've seen scattered reports of Dropbox not working after the upgrade to Windows 10, mostly resolved by reinstalling Dropbox.com.
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LOL, I still don't know how I'm going to do a clean install of Windows 10 if I had to. Guess I need to look into doing that at some point, huh? LOL
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Just to be clear, I was only talking about reinstalling Dropbox itself, not Windows 10.
As for a clean install if you do want to do that, there's an option to reset Windows 10 back to the factory settings. You can find it here: http://windows.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-10/windows-10-recovery-options
Make sure to do a complete backup before doing a reset.
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Ok, just tried the Windows beta build. I can't get my vault to open. I put in my password and hit open and it just shows "Password hint:" below the text entry box and doesn't do anything else. I've tried restarting the program a couple times here with the same results. Any ideas?
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I even restarted the computer to make sure.
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Hi @Steveken,
I need more information, what Windows beta build are you referring to? I apologize, it's just that it came out of nowhere and I'm not sure if you're referring to Windows Insider beta builds, 1Password for Windows betas, or 1Password for Windows 10 Beta in the Windows store.
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The "1Password for Windows Modern" I think it was called. The 1Password Beta that is in the Windows Store right now. The one we were talking about in regards to the pricing and all that previously. I'm not sure what version it is, but I am guessing it might be Beta 9, 2016.1.1200. I was directed to give it a shot after I asked about the UI things I mentioned here to the Twitter rep. That was before I knew about this forum.
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Hi @steveken,
Yea, we need to figure out the names as it is difficult to tell them apart.
We have a separate forum for the Windows 10 Store Beta version of 1Password, you can visit it here.
I would recommend creating a separate thread in that forum with your issue, so our Windows 10 Store app team can help you quickly. If you want me to split your comment and move it to the forum, I can do that as well, just let me know.
Can you tell me if when you open the Windows 10 app, did you ask it to open your vault in the Dropbox folder? If yes, does your vault's folder name ends in .agilekeychain or .opvault?
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Nah, I'll just go do it myself. Thanks though.
Yeah, it did all the stuff telling me about it on 3 pages and then on the 4th asking me where it was. I told it Dropbox, linked it to my Dropbox account, told it which vault to use (there's only 1), and put in my password. That's when it did the stuff I mentioned before. It is labeled as 1Password.agilekeychain.
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Hi @steveken,
Please do mention that info in the other thread. I think you may have to change your master password to make it work as there is an issue with certain old .agilekeychain files that the beta can't decrypt. You can change it back to your original password and it should then work.
However, I would wait for the other team to see if they have a better solution and they might need the logs from you to see what's going on.
If there's anything we can do to help with the regular Windows app, let us know here.
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You're welcome! I'm glad I can help.
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@MikeT Thanks for the tip on type-to-search in the list of matching logins on Windows. I'll echo the annoyance at the way it works but being able to type to search will be helpful from time to time, as I have a few sites with very long lists of logins! I agree Mac does this in a very awesome way, nice to know Windows does it kind-of, and good to hear Windows will eventually match even if the under-the-hood part is different (which I completely understand). I know it's coming so I don't complain unless there's something that appears to be an actual bug, but the general lack of speed on Windows in addition to some of the GUI niceties are strongly looked-forward-to (and when I go through my Vault to audit items and update things in bulk, I pull out my MacBook :-)
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Hi @dszp,
Thanks for the tip on type-to-search in the list of matching logins on Windows
You're welcome. We've added that as soon as we heard of the initial beta feedback of the inability to search and the issue with dealing with the long list of items.
We've added many workarounds to make it easier to use over time, Open in 1Password was added to let you edit the item directly in the main program and so on.
I know it's coming so I don't complain unless there's something that appears to be an actual bug
Keep them coming, they do help us know where we need to focus in the future and we might be able to find a quick workaround in a quick update. Please do share your feedback and you never know, we might have a better trick you can use like type-to-search.
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I'd really like to see the same "All Vaults" functionality present on OS X and iOS on the Windows version of 1Password. When switching between vaults, having to type in the master password each time on the Windows version is extremely annoying. Additionally, the browser extensions only retrieve logins from the selected vault rather than presenting logins from all of the vaults like the extensions do on OS X. Both of these make the 1Password for Windows application feel a bit like the red-headed step-child of the 1Password family of applications. Even the Windows 10 version of 1Password doesn't require you to re-input your password when switching between vaults.
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Hi @Dwimmerlaik,
That's not likely to come to the current version of 1Password for Windows, it requires a massive overhaul of how 1Password works to make it happen. This happened already on both Mac and iOS a few years ago with its changeover to an internal database structure. The beta version of 1Password for Windows 10 is a brand new app being built as a Universal Windows Platform (UWP) app, so it is coded with this in mind but built differently. Not to mention, it has access to UWP APIs that enables the use of Windows Hello as well as a secure credentials manager.
1Password for Windows right now read and writes to your data file directly, which is why when you switch to a different file, you need to enter the password for the file. On Mac/iOS, all of your vaults are imported into a single database encrypted with the primary vault's master password. This allows 1Password to enable features like All Vaults, it can read all vaults at once without needing separate passwords, thus the easier switching between vaults. We have to switch the Windows program to an internal database structure as well and that's on our list. We'll be releasing more details in the near future.
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I can certainly understand the amount of rework. What is the intention of 1Password for Windows 10 vs 1Password for Windows? I like the Windows 10 version, but support for browser extensions isn't there, which is the largest use cases of the program. I would switch to the Windows 10 version if there was support for extensions. The regular 1Password for Windows program supports extensions, but has so many things that make it much more cumbersome to use than the Mac and iOS versions. I understand that Mac and iOS have always been the focus, but so many of us are forced onto Windows PCs as a result of corporate ignorance and having a version of 1Password that has the same functionality as what we enjoy on our Macs, iPhones, and iPads is critical.
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Hi @Dwimmerlaik,
It wasn't the original intention to build the Windows 10 app. It started out initially as a brand new modern app for the Windows 8 Mobile platform and when Microsoft announced the massive project, Universal Windows Platform (UWP), to unify the codebase between Windows for all devices running Windows 10, we then switched to this platform and it was very simple to enable the support for the Windows desktop, so we enabled it and let folks use the same app on both of their Windows 10 mobile devices along with Windows 10 desktops.
The lack of browser extension is because UWP apps are sandboxed, think of iOS apps but more flexible and can run on more platforms than just iOS devices. We can't exceed what UWP doesn't support. In addition, you can't integrate with other apps on Windows 10 mobile devices like you can on the desktops.
Right now, our UWP version is relatively very young to the rest of our apps and we'll be shipping the first version in the near future. We are going to add support for extensions if we can find a way but for now, we're focusing on the core features before we get to the extensions. For an example, we only just added support for TOTP in the last two weeks.
The UWP and classic desktop versions are being developed by two separate teams, so the work in one team doesn't affect the other team.
As for the regular desktop program, it is going to get a major update but we do not release details about our future plans until the code is done first. We do plan to benefit from the work being done in UWP in terms of the design.
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