Moving Beyond 1PasswordAnywhere discussion

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  • AGAlumBAGAlumB
    1Password Alumni
    edited May 2016

    Thank you for your messages but it seems we both see things differently. Me as the customer, you as the employee of the company.

    @NickRo: Not at all. This isn't a customer/employee, "us versus them" thing, and I'm sorry if anything I've said gave you that impression. I'm a 1Password user (and customer) just like you, even though I work for AgileBits.

    It's still the same situation - we have to pay more to get a web front-end for our vault, even if we are not a family and might not need shared vaults. And yes, while 1PasswordAnywhere might have been a temporary solution, this hasn't been communicated with those people buying it.
    You knew Dropbox would discontinue the service at some point - we, as the customer didn't knew that a feature we need would be removed. I say removed because all other "workarounds" are no real solution.

    1PasswordAnywhere isn't a product we sold and then discontinued or removed. I also have fond memories of 1PasswordAnywhere, going all the way back to 2009. It's served me well too. But early last year I stopped relying on 1Password.html in my Dropbox account myself after probably the second time it stopped working. As time went on and there were further issues with it, I was also very straightforward with customers here on the forums in my role as an AgileBits team member when I explained, even after Dropbox had gotten it working again, that 1PasswordAnywhere's days were numbered. I wouldn't want anyone else to rely on something that might not work in the future anymore than I was willing to. And it made me uneasy not knowing exactly when this might come to pass.

    At that point, 1Password Teams/Families wasn't an option for anyone, including AgileBits staff, so there was no browser-based alternative for even myself. I took precautions of making sure I had my 1Password data on multiple devices, but also that the most important information in it was available to me in other forms (passport, medical, etc.). And after all, it has never been a good idea to access sensitive information on an untrusted device, so 1PasswordAnywhere was always a last resort in the years since 1Password has been available on many platforms. Fortunately, unlike 2009, 1Password is available on enough platforms these days that I can reasonably have my data with me pretty much wherever I go. Worst case scenario, I need to pull some actual documents out. And in most cases this is required when dealing with the authorities anyway. ;)

    I appreciate that this is a blow to your existing workflow, but we can't simply will 1PasswordAnywhere back from the dead, and its best days are long behind it anyway. 1Password 3 was developed alongside 1PasswordAnywhere in 2009, yet I don't hear anyone calling for us to resurrect it and update it for El Capitan. Yet, much like 1Password Teams/Families costs money for those who might want to use it as an alternative to 1PasswordAnywhere, 1Password 6 is a paid upgrade from a 1Password 3 license.

    Technology marches on, and we march with it because we all expect that a new OS or browser will have a new 1Password update to support it. But as much as we'd love to give everything away as a free update, we also need to charge sustainable prices for new products so we'll be able to offer more updates — some free and some paid — in the future as well.

  • AGAlumBAGAlumB
    1Password Alumni
    edited May 2016

    This is your product and if it is not compatible with widely used plattform, you have to tell customers. If your product become not compatible with El Captan, you have to say this. People want this email or do you do not want information about product you paid for?

    @nol: As I mentioned above, 1Password 3 is not compatible with El Capitan, but I don't think it's reasonable for us to send out a mass email telling people that software written in 2009 doesn't work on a platform in 2016. You may feel differently of course, but I think we'd get a lot more flak (and rightly so) for spamming people like that than we're getting here for another bundle of 2009 code that no longer works with a popular cloud service.

    And one thing, you now are writing in a way that makes us look dumb. We know that landscape has change. Again, you advertised this as feature now you have soltuione (web access) but only if you pay more money. Remove 4 members and give web access to old customers and all good. Simple. Or make a $12/year plan like other company or even make $20 but not $60. I am sorry if I offend anyone here or if someone is thinking I am not speaking for them.

    I too am sorry if I gave any offense. That wasn't my intention. I'm trying to be clear about the reality of the situation for anyone who might visit this discussion.

    I appreciate that it may be a loss to your workflow that 1Password.html can no longer function with Dropbox as it once did, but I don't really think it's reasonable to expect us to create a brand new product and give it away for free. Make no mistake, it's been really cool to have two major upgrades for free since 1Password 3 was released in 2009, but ultimately we have a responsibility to ourselves, our families, and our awesome customers to make sure we're around to keep making 1Password even better, and that means charging for major upgrades — or brand new products — sometimes.

    For those like me for whom 1PasswordAnywhere was once a big part of our lives, we really took a hit every time it had trouble and couldn't load from our Dropbox accounts these past few years. We took notice. 1Password Families/Teams is an alternative I'm glad to have now, since I didn't for most of last year. And by that same token, it seems to me that it's been worth my hard-earned money.

    But of course that's a calculation we all have to make for ourselves. And if you don't feel that the benefits you get from it are worth the cost, Dave outlined a number of free alternatives — including hosting 1PasswordAnywhere yourself. That's something I did for a while myself, and it was fun. Much like other "sync-it-yourself" options, it appealed to my "rugged individualism" streak. But ultimately the convenience of 1Password for iOS won out for me.

  • nolnol
    Community Member

    @brenty You are leaving out content in your quotes which makes different story.
    I make last time: I do not care about Windows, never have. Sorry. I do not know why you bringe this up everytime. I am on Mac and Linux and Chromebooke.

    Why I buyed 1Pasword is for same reason AgileBits says in its own blog post:

    1Password is a Mac application, but what about the times when you’re visiting that one family member for the holidays who hasn’t switched yet, and you need your webmail password? Maybe you’re on Linux at work, or simply someone else’s Mac, and you need to quickly look up some FTP credentials or a Secure Note? If you don’t sync 1Password with one of our 1Password touch apps for iPhone and iPod touch, 1PasswordAnywhere has you covered.

    This is why. Not because of Windows. Also I do not care about iDisk but DropBox.
    You offered feature now you say DropBox changes things and you have to move further. But you still do not care about the single user. The one who does not need shared vaults or to add more people to his account. The one who needs only a regular account with web access. You do not see him or care.
    Give me for one time the answer and not avoiding it. Why do you can buy standalone product which is good for one person but no web access but can not make plan only for single user with web access? You web access is only a new 1PasswordAnywhere if you remove the shared vault and family thing. Nothing else. This is what I see as customer. It is always talking around why we compare old things with new version. No. We compare value of money with service. See there is already so much talking going on instead of figuring out what is good for both not only for company pockets. You keep defending price increase for single users or you do not acknowledge it in saying "Hey look like we made mistake, no worry we fix for you". Why you do yourselfe so hard? But ok, public can read all this and see what is going on and make desission to stay with you or move to other company for 1/5 of price and more features.

  • tonydowtonydow
    Community Member

    Does the 1Password.html file in Dropbox still get updated when changes are made in 1Password?

  • s4njis4nji
    Community Member

    @tonydow yes, the only thing that doesn't work anymore is 1PasswordAnywhere access via Dropbox interface.

    The dropbox synchronization is not affected at all.

  • BenBen AWS Team

    Team Member

    @tonydow,

    Technically it never did (and still doesn't). The 1Password.html file doesn't change. 1PasswordAnywhere reads from the other files in your keychain, similar to how our 1Password client apps would. And that is the part that Dropbox no longer supports.

    Ben

  • massive323massive323
    Community Member

    super disappointed in this, I find the 1passwordanywhere access absolutely essential. I don't have a laptop and I'm not a smart phone user and hopefully never will be. I'm confused about the dropbox sync - so it still 'update' the file that's in there but you can't actually do anything with that file now anyhow? How do I 'host' the file - is there a luddite's guide anywhere?

  • BenBen AWS Team

    Team Member
    edited May 2016

    @massive323

    Unfortunately not. We can't recommend the use of 1PasswordAnywhere any longer. If you'd like to have web access to your 1Password data currently the only solutions we can recommend are our 1Password Families or 1Password Teams subscription services. Each of these services offers a web client, in addition to a number of other features not available in the standalone apps.

    It is possible in the future we'll have an alternate solution which does not require a Families or Teams subscription (perhaps an individual subscription option), but I don't have anything concrete to share at this time.

    I'm sorry for the inconvenience.

    Ben

  • tonydowtonydow
    Community Member
    edited May 2016

    @bwoodruff @dteare Dave Teare stated in the first item of this discussion "First, you can continue to use 1PasswordAnywhere with an Agile Keychain stored locally or on a USB drive. Many browsers restrict access to local files, however, so be sure to configure your browser to allow local file access.
    If this is true, why can't you provide a guide on how to achieve this?

  • AGAlumBAGAlumB
    1Password Alumni

    @tonydow: There are a lot of browsers out there — many neither of us may even be aware of (I always forget about poor WaterFox) — and the setup would differ vastly from one to another. Fortunately most browsers ahem their own knowledgebases and communities that can help with configuration. :)

  • tonydowtonydow
    Community Member

    @brenty I don't think anyone would expect you to cover every conceivable browser. There are instructions in another thread which covers the main ones but that would need to be searched for. I feel you are creating obstacles. What is needed is a guide on the steps required to access data held locally or on USB - what files need to be copied from Dropbox, which file needs to be 'run' etc. Generally try to be a bit more helpful.

  • BenBen AWS Team

    Team Member

    We're not encouraging anyone to continue to use 1PasswordAnywhere. 1PasswordAnywhere is for all intents and purposes dead. So, while we're not going to create obstacles to its use, we're also not going to be able to provide step by step instructions for things like disabling security features in your browser to be able to use it.

    I'm sorry that is the state of things, but that is where we're at. 1PasswordAnywhere is dead. Long live 1PasswordAnywhere.

    Ben

  • Nathan_infinityNathan_infinity
    Community Member
    edited May 2016

    So basically what you are saying is pay the 60$ and shut up no support will be given, which is kinda sad because I will never pay a family license for a single user so I will probably end up going elsewhere and my guess is you'll loose alot of business.. 1password anywhere like alot of people was one of the main reason I was using your services

  • BenBen AWS Team

    Team Member

    You are correct in that we are no longer supporting 1PasswordAnywhere.

    At the moment 1Password Teams or 1Password Families is the only real solution, but we are investigating other possibilities for the future. We'd like to be able to offer something more enticing for individuals.

    Thanks!

    Ben

  • nolnol
    Community Member

    See I told they do not care.
    First they say it does not work anymore ONLY because of Dropbox changed thinks. NOW they say it is complete dead.
    So they removed feature for what we paid for. They were lying when saying it is only dropbox issue. Now they do not support it anymore.
    They have alternative for 1Password anywhere, it is web access which looks only more nice, something 1PasswordAnywhere needed for years. Simple, you get web access only if you pay family plan which is more expensive.
    Yes I am loud in this thread because this is no right and bad practice how you manage clients.
    I bet most people are individuals using 1password and less family who are now forced to use web access.
    Web access is great with one big issue why it is not 1PasswordAnywhere you now need account key in additione. I wonder why you all think we do not see what is going on. It is easy to make new plan.
    This all is going down the hill. And really, if one is asking for instructions from you to show how you removed feature should work with your suggested solution, just take 5 min time and help him. Many browsers? Look at the market share and you see 3 most common browsers. Take top two and you cover post people.
    I am sorry AgileBits there was so many <3 in past but you broke everything for not caring about individuals.

  • tonydowtonydow
    Community Member

    @dteare What is your original statement worth now. You need to sort this out.

  • MattDinOCMattDinOC
    Community Member

    Having been a happy happy 1Password customer for over 2 years, I decided to register just to make this comment...

    I have used 1PasswordAnywhere on occasion when needed. Like most 1Password users, I do always have my smartphone with me and can do the manual transcription of my long-random-string passwords when needed. But doing so is archaic, annoying, and to be avoided. As has been noted, having to do this on a regular basis would encourage me to ultimately use weaker passwords. I didn't realize until today that 1PasswordAnywhere had stopped working, and I had to do a fair bit of searching to find this thread.

    If it was only a once-a-year type of need, I would personally be fine with 1PasswordAnywhere being dead. It always seemed like a bit of a security risk in my gut, but the convenience outweighed such concerns. If I were to use it regularly, I would pay more attention to security precautions (private mode, flush cache, etc.).

    However, my workplace is going toward the scenario that others have described here. No administrative permissions on our work PCs, so no client software. The only practical method to maintain access to my 250+ logins stored in my 1Password vault in such an environment would be 1PasswordAnywhere. But that's gone now. My options now seem to be:

    1. Subscribe to 1Password Families at $5/month.
    2. Change my passwords as needed from a long-random-strings to passphrases to make it easier to transcribe from phone to PC.
    3. Sign up for a trial membership of 1Password Families to gain web access, then cancel, at which point I will retain read-only web access to my vault.

    Option #1 is not good at all. I have already paid for my license, and while I understand the need for the occasional paid upgrade cycle, $5/month is just out of line with the market for the needs of an individual.

    Option #2 might be doable, but I would need to work around the inevitable websites which place unreasonably small max length restrictions on their passwords, do some reading on how many words/letters are needed to maintain the level of security of my current default password generation settings, and go around changing a bunch of passwords as I encounter them. Also, given the number of times in a day I use the 1Password browser extension, this transcription is bound to become tiresome very rapidly, leading me to use less secure passwords...

    Option #3 would probably be my best bet, although there is no telling how long that will continue to work. And frankly, it feels kinda dirty. I'm not a fan of using tools in ways that run counter to their original intent.

    The other options that were mentioned are nonstarters for me. My company IT department restricts access to USB storage devices in the interest of malware risk mitigation.

    I felt compelled to write this essay in the hope that it really does make a difference to the AgileBits team that your customers are asking for a secure, reasonably priced method to access our vaults via web browser. I know this has already been said, but I wanted to register my vote as well. Personally, I would be willing to pay about $30/year for such, with the understanding that it does cost AgileBits money to offer such a feature. No extra features or cloud storage needed. I would also hope that some pricing concession is offered to customers who paid for an upfront license recently, assuming that all their needs would be met. Since I paid for 1Password over 2 years ago, I feel that I have certainly gotten my money's worth out of it, and I would not expect any pricing concession. But it would be a different story if I had paid for it just a couple months ago, and now was being asked to start paying a monthly subscription fee on top of that!

    As great as 1Password is, if my company IT folks were to wipe all unauthorized software from my work PC tomorrow, I would sign up for 1Password Families to get browser-based vault access back, and then immediately start evaluating alternatives. Fortunately, I'm not there yet, but if a lower-cost 1Password subscription does not become available by the time that decision point comes, I would need to find a different password manager, and I could no longer recommend it to my coworkers as I have many times over the past 2 years.

    Respectfully yours,
    Matt

  • david_ddavid_d
    Community Member

    I bought 1Password just over a year ago (April 2015) and paid the premium price specifically because I wanted to avoid a subscription model and was willing to pay a larger sum upfront in order to have all the features I desired into the indefinite future. I'm very disappointed to learn that 1PasswordAnywhere is no longer being supported and that no real alternative has been offered to those of us who chose 1Password for this feature in the not too distant past.

    I most frequently use a Mac but regularly use a Linux computer, for which there is still no good alternative to 1PasswordAnywhere. I suppose in the near term I will type in passwords from my phone, but if I am going to be ultimately forced into a subscription model it's hard to see why as an individual user I'd choose 1Password over its competitors.

  • GJbrizzleGJbrizzle
    Community Member
    edited May 2016

    What MattDinOC said above.

    And my bit...

    I only found out by accident that 1PasswordAnywhere was no longer working. I am surprised that users weren't alerted by email to this change. (I've read the explanation given for not alerting customers, and it's not very persuasive.)

    My use case: having a way to gain access to passwords if I lost my phone while travelling. I never actually used it, but the backup it provided was important to me. It's only by luck that I've found out that this backup is no longer there; it's lucky I didn't find out when trying to use it for real.

    I've thought about and tried various workarounds and found nothing that really works yet. The Chrome local-files fix does work, but that requires Chrome to be installed, and if I'm travelling I might not have access to a computer with Chrome installed.

    A solution I can imagine is for there to be a portable version of the 1Password client which could be used on a USB stick along with a copy of the keychain downloaded from Dropbox. I believe a portable version of 1Password has been requested in the past. Perhaps this could be pushed up the wishlist.

    Yours,

    Gary

  • tonydowtonydow
    Community Member

    @dteare Again. You stated in the first item of this thread "First, you can continue to use 1PasswordAnywhere with an Agile Keychain stored locally or on a USB drive". Why is a request for detailed information on how to achieve this, step by step, being actively denied or possibly ignored. I know you can't cover all the possible browser configurations but the vast majority of users would be covered by the major ones or would possibly be willing to change to one of those to get this functionality back.

  • Nathan_infinityNathan_infinity
    Community Member

    So if I understand correctly if I sign up for a trial family plan I gain back acces to a Web interface even if I cancel?

  • trainwrekktrainwrekk
    Community Member

    Wow. What irony!

    I had just started using LastPass when they were bought out in October. For fear of bad support and rising prices, I was persuaded by a 1Password employee to switch. Since I use a Chromebook 90% of the time, 1PasswordAnywhere was the last nudge I needed to commit to the switch. I paid for Mac + Windows + Android just in case I ever needed it on a non-chromebook device (which I do occasionally at work) and felt good about escaping from that horrible LastPass/LogMeIn merger that was sure to become a failure. As an IT person, I even started recommending 1P to users.

    6 months later and I can no longer use 1Password on my main device, the solution is to pay more money, and I'm not even offered a refund. Meanwhile, LastPass prices have stayed the same, all of their features have continued to work, and I could be using it on my Chromebook if I had stayed with them.

    Boy, do I feel like an idiot. At least now I have an anecdote to tell when people ask me to suggest a password manager.

  • Nathan_infinityNathan_infinity
    Community Member

    So after getting the family plan trial is it normal I can't load my current vault and have to reenter manually all my passwords??

  • tanwaldtanwald
    Community Member
    edited May 2016

    I still think that you have never had a meeting on how to keep features for customers who desperately need them or thought about your customers needs in the first place. The reasons you thought 1PasswordAnywhere is needed are obviously not congruent with those of your customers. Probably you had a meeting on how to make more money but this is just educated guessing. Blaming technologies to evolve (Dropbox,...) is cheap. You just have to keep up with technology!

    For my need, to access credentials on Linux, I have created a cross-platform application which essentially does what 1PasswordAnywhere did for me. It's my first Gtk application and took me 3 days...

    For anyone who is interested: https://github.com/tanwald/passpy

    For what we offer, the math at 3$ for 3 just doesn't work

    Dropbox offers 2GB for free, my keychain has about 500KB and you sell software which costs around $70. What kind of math are you talking about? The math of greed? I'm not sure if I will buy another release of your software. Maybe you've made the math without your customers...

    I'm sorry if I'm doing you injustice. I'm sitting on a different country - in a different world - and I'm only telling my impressions.

  • 1Pfanatic1Pfanatic
    Community Member

    Dave, I have long used 1P Anywhere, and really miss it now. Here is a specific need, which I hope you can address:
    I have a lot of personal information stored in 1P that a family member needs to be able to access in the event of my death or illness. She does not have 1Password installed, on her Macintosh or PC, and does not want to. But in case of an emergency, she needs to have access. She is in a different city, not close to my computer and would likely not be able to get access to it anyway. How can she access my stored information in such a case? Thanks!

  • dancodanco Senior Member
    Volunteer Moderator

    @1Pfanatic why does your family member not want to have 1PW? Is it a matter of cost or some other reason?

    The free trial version would allow access to your passwords (if you use Dropbox sync) which should be all she needs.

    I too wish that 1PW Anywhere had been kept. I've never needed to use it, but it feels like a lifeline if my devices got stolen.

    It seems that AgileBits (like most developers, I feel) did not attempt to gather information from customers BEFORE making changes. If they had, they might have found a great demand for 1PW Anywhere or might have found that, despite the posts in this thread, hardly anyone needed it. @tanwald , saying "you just have to keep up with the technology" means nothing unless the developers know of the demand, it's perfectly possible that the programming time needed to make the changes would overwhelm other development for very little purpose, or it might be that the work needed is justified by the demand.

  • 1Pfanatic1Pfanatic
    Community Member

    My sister just doesn't want to install it, or much of anything new. It takes more time, effort (and sometimes angst) to try to explain the virtues of such software than it's worth. Some people just want to stay with what they know.

    I'm a HUGE 1Password fan, as you can tell by my screen name. Been using it since version 1. And I find the company very responsive. Like you and others, however, I feel a mistake was made disabling/abandoning 1P anywhere. Surely there is a way to use it, even if on a special site AgileBits creates for nothing more than Anywhere.

    But thanks for your suggestion for the free trial scheme. Even that is probably more than she can deal with. (I know, I know.) Cheers.

  • daysleeper033daysleeper033
    Community Member

    I hate to pile on, but agilebits should know how their customers feel. I used 1PA on a daily basis for the same reason all the other commenters did: work computer, cannot install software or employ the USB option. The offered solutions aren't real solutions and the defensive response from agilebits support is unhelpful at best. A few thoughts:

    First, as others have said, AT MINIMUM, the fact that this was going to happen should have been communicated. I'd got used to the fact that 1PA would stop working for a few days after major Dropbox updates, but the solution would be found before long and voila, 1PA would be back. I always saw that as an example of good customer service. This time, after an unusually long delay, I had to search out a support thread for answers, only to find that support has been discontinued.

    Second, this is being described by support as a Dropbox compatibility issue. So I'm genuinely asking: is there something about this Dropbox update that makes finding a solution (as agilebits had done every time in the past there was a Dropbox update) impossible? Or is it simply that agilebits doesn't want to dedicate resources to doing so going forward? The latter may simply be the answer, but again that needs to be communicated -- and not in the "stupid Dropbox updating their software amirite" way it's been communicated here. If agilebits gas chooses to sunset that commitment of resources in favor of pushing 1Password Family, they need to own up to the fact that they're doing that for that reason.

    Third, what a botch job the support response in this forum has been! Maybe it would have been good to have a team meeting on this issue before sending out support staff to chime in on the discussion boards. I've got one person telling me I need to start hosting my own site or carry around a USB all the time to use 1PA (sure, let me get right on that), another says if I weaken my passwords my dumb eyes can read them better on my phone while I transcribe them into my computer (um, seriously?), and another just says "the dream is dead cheapskates go buy Families." You people need to get on the same page because clearly you didn't anticipate this blowback.

    Not to take away from the fact that you folks do great work. Love your product. More importantly, I RECOMMEND your product to people all the time. But this was a misstep on a lot of different levels.

  • babyjeansbabyjeans
    Community Member

    Wow, with so many years of use of 1Password and purchasing multiple licenses for all of my devices, I feel as a customer you really don't care about us. Brenty has shown how much vitriol can be spewed by your team, fully misunderstanding and then defensively arguing with customers? You might want to keep him off the forums in the future.

    As for me, I guess since you're dropping 1PA making 1P useless for me at work where I can not install Dropbox to sync, I'm going to have to move on to a newer service that understands its customers. The fact you'd make this change before updating your web plans shows you have a lack of business and customer understanding, and I'm 100% offended that I spent all this money on your products for you to drop support like this.

    I will be no longer be recommending 1password to anyone, not that it really hurts your bottom line, but you should be aware of your missteps.

  • pete_dpete_d
    Community Member

    I too am one of the many disenchanted long time users of 1Password to find that access to 1Password Anywhere has been removed. Our family has used 1PA for quite some time now and it has been extremely helpful. I understand that a $60/year family subscription will bring web access back, but wow, no thanks.

This discussion has been closed.