iOS Restrictions App Rating 17+ [1Browser: built-in browser mandates this App Store rating]

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Comments

  • BenBen AWS Team

    Team Member

    Hi @JMcClane72

    Indeed. tombr pointed that out above. :)

    We're not going to do two separate apps as that is a nightmare, but we will continue to evaluate the value of 1Browser moving forward.

    Ben

  • I realize you won't be changing anything, and I respect that, but just know that I've been a happy 1Password customer for several years and I'm now looking for an alternative. You run your business as you see fit, obviously, but you are definitely losing a certain amount of customers as a result of these choices.

  • BenBen AWS Team

    Team Member
    edited July 2020

    @davidstults

    Thanks for the feedback. We're really not happy about the sitaution here either, but our hands are tied. We're put in the position of choosing between:

    1. Removing 1Browser to get a lower age raiting, frustrating customers by removing a feature they rely on, forcing them to change their workflow or
    2. Keeping 1Browser and the associated age restriction, frustrating customers who cannot use the app due to the restrictions, for whom 'Ask to Buy' is not a viable alternative

    We lose customers either way. We're still evaluating which is the lesser of the evils.

    Ben

  • Or: 3. Pause new feature development for a while, and factorise your code base so that you can easily maintain and QA a separate version without the browser (but sharing most of the codebase) so that you can genuinely call it "1Password for Families"!!

    Sorry for being snarky, but I am resentful of the amount I have cumulatively paid for this and, now that my children are of an age to use it, they can't.

  • BenBen AWS Team

    Team Member

    We're not going to offer two separate 1Password for iOS apps. We've tried that in the past, and it simply creates too much confusion for customers (development issues completely aside). I'm sorry but that route is off the table.

    I empathize with your plight and I'm hopeful that we'll be able to find a better solution in the future. For now, Ask to Buy is the only option we can offer.

    Ben

  • kdroyerkdroyer
    edited August 2020

    Dump the in-app browser and develop the product to seamlessly integrate with browsers that people do use. I guarantee you people that are using the in-app browser have already had to "change their workflow" from the Chrome or Safari that they are already using for all their other web browsing (those sites to which they are not dependant on 1Password). In-app browsers are not a desirable feature, they are a workaround, imo. A truly outstanding product will do both of: 1) fully integrate with a user's default browser, eliminating the need for an in-app tool; and 2) If offering a family-specific product, be compatible with the family controls on the device.

    Your other option is to drop the family subscription and promote the team subscription as an alternative. At least then your marketing message will line up with your audience. As it stands today, parents looking for "family" products are most likely going to have parental controls enabled on the device making this an incompatible product.

    Like others I am frustrated that I'm paying for a family subscription that cannot deliver a family product. If your going to continue to market a family subscription it should be made abundantly clear before people buy that the product will not work if family controls are enabled (unless, of course the family is all over 17 - but that's a moot point because by 18 the restrictions are gone anyway).

    Thanks for listening! Aside from this 1Password is a great product!

  • ag_anaag_ana

    Team Member

    @kdroyer:

    Dump the in-app browser and develop the product to seamlessly integrate with browsers that people do use.

    I am afraid that the solution is not this simple: 1Password already seamlessly integrates with other browsers, but we have several users who still rely on the built-in 1Browser, perhaps just for personal preference because they have done so for years and that's their favorite way.

    As my colleague Ben wrote above, no matter what we choose we are going to make some people unhappy unfortunately. Users who rely on 1Browser but don't care about age restrictions as you do would request exactly the opposite behavior as you are requesting, so it's not a simple decision.

  • kdroyerkdroyer
    edited August 2020

    Understood. I would recommend that 1Password discontinue the "family" subscription and point users to the team-based subscription. Marketing a family subscription is misleading as this product can only be used by adults. The product is not able to deliver a family experience unless you are a family of adults-only. Thanks!

  • ag_anaag_ana

    Team Member

    Thank you for your feedback @kdroyer! We will continue to evaluate what the best choice would be :+1:

  • I've read this whole thread. I hear you @ag_ana and @Ben, and I don't think you are hearing us. I get it, Agile Bits has to make tough design decisions because of Apple's App Store policies. The users who have commented on this issue for the past 3 years just don't think you made the right decision for your user base - and I agree with them.

    As a happy user of 1Password Families AND a parent of someone under 17, I find your lack of engagement a bit frustrating. (as a total aside, I'm guessing you guys don't have kids, because you seem quickly dismissive of the concerns from parents). I bet if you polled your users, the vast majority would choose the the rating to be lowered with the acceptable loss in 1Browser workflow. Many people here have kids who they want to protect and teach good internet security habits with the convenience of tools like 1Password, but the workarounds you suggest create additional exposure risks for kids to inappropriate content, and that is not a real solution.

    Might I suggest Agile Bits add some sort of voting system for feature requests, I think the results would surprise you.

  • BenBen AWS Team

    Team Member
    edited August 2020

    @1pass_user_fam

    I'm sorry we've made you feel that way. We listen to all of the feedback we receive, compile it, and pass it along to our development teams and "the powers that be," who ultimately make the decisions on what direction 1Password takes. We have shared the concerns expressed in this thread, but at this point it seems unlikely 1Browser will be removed from the current app and thus the 17+ raiting will likely remain. That leaves us in the position of helping people with available workarounds — in this case Apple's 'Ask to Buy' feature. Additionally we will continue to advocate for consideration when it comes to planning for future iterations of the offering.

    I understand this may not be ideal from the perspective of those trying to use 1Password with their family, but we're in the position of having to do the best we can with what options are available to us.

    Personally I have been using 'Ask to Buy' with good results.

    Ben

  • I'm a new user and like some was surprised to find the IOS app is restricted to 17+. I found this thread after I couldn't install it for my kids on their IOS devices. It would be good if 1password for families included those under 17 using IOS devices.

    Since IOS 14 now includes the option to select a default browser, this might be a good time to (re)consider removing 1password built-in browser that is causing the Apple 17+ rating.

    It has been discussed in this thread you don't want to maintain coding for two separate apps, but if you eliminate the built-in browser, I'm guessing the coding to launch/use the default browser (chrome, safari, firefox, etc.) would be much less to maintain. You could still have the open & fill feature for those who use it, just it would open/fill using the default browser set in IOS 14. Eliminating the built-in browser would also help to standardized features across the 1password apps, as the Windows app and the cloud version don't have the built-in browser, instead they use the browser on the device.

  • BenBen AWS Team

    Team Member

    Thanks @Digital05. We are continuing to evaluate the tradeoffs between removing 1Browser and having a 17+ rating. I'm not in a position to make promises about which way it'll fall at this point but for the next generation 1Password app on iOS this is one of the big things we're discussing.

    Ben

  • I just realized this had happened. My child hadn't told me that they no longer had access to 1Password. This forces me to chose between parental controls for every other app and 1Password. I'm dismayed. This is incredibly frustrating.

  • BenBen AWS Team

    Team Member
    edited November 2020

    @grigs

    Turning off age restrictions and instead enabling Ask to Buy may be a workable compromise. I wish we didn't have to have a 17+ rating for 1Password, but that's what the App Store rules require of us at this point.

    Ben

  • Reading the full thread, I want to echo those who have said that if you’re not going to solve this, that you should stop advertising 1Password as a solution for families. It isn’t. And I say this as someone who has been a big fan of 1Password for years.

  • BenBen AWS Team

    Team Member

    The only way to "resolve" it would be to remove 1Browser, which will surely upset as many as it will satisfy. We are considering that option for the next generation of 1Password for iOS, though.

    Ben

  • @Ben I don't know why you chose to put quotes around "resolve." I didn't use that word.

    Throughout this thread you've repeated the point that removing 1Browser would upset as many people as this change would satisfy. I get that it's a hard trade off. But it is a trade off because of the constraints 1Password has placed on itself:

    • You include a browser that makes the app 17+ per app store guidelines.
    • You refuse to consider splitting the app because it is too much work. (What was that $200M for anyways?)
    • You advertise a solution for families.

    You can't have all three. I agree that it sucks that iOS works the way that it does, but unless Epic wins its lawsuit, that's just the way it is.

    This thread as existed since 2017. Despite that long history, the marketing page for 1Password Families touts apps on iOS and doesn't say anything in either the marketing materials or on the system requirements page linked to from that page that in order to use it on iOS for children, that you can't use iOS's built-in parental controls the way they are designed to be used.

    Why not? It's a safe assumption anyone evaluating a "family password manager" wouldn't expect the app to be 17+.

    So I get it. You can't remove 1Browser without making some people mad. You may remove it in a future release. That would be cool with me, but I get it isn't an easy decision.

    In the meantime, stop claiming you have a family product via an iOS app. You don't.

  • ag_anaag_ana

    Team Member

    Thank you again for your feedback @grigs, it's really appreciated. Our team will certainly keep your feedback into consideration as we move forward :+1:

  • primeprime
    edited November 2020

    Why don't you just take a poll if anyone would miss the browser? There's Twitter and you can email users. If remove it makes it better for families with kids under 17, I'm all for it. The fact Apple made it easier to auto-fill in other bowers, the 1Browesr is not longer really needed.
    The only time I use 1Brower now, is when it's by accident.

  • I can only repeat what has been written above. Please, do not promote a family plan unless you got rid of the 17+ rating.
    As an end user I see the app and evaluate the functions I am using. Using the family plan, the app is practically not available for younger family members. Imho, 1Password‘s main feature is to store passwords and other stuff I need to protect, a build-in Browser ist not! I‘ve never used it. So you have to decide: dropping a “nice to have feature” or families with kids, or go the extra mile and invest “the work”. Your decision.

  • I've used the app since the version 3 days when it was "confusing" to have multiple apps in the app store, but +1 to the responses of other parents here...

    • App should absolutely not be marketed to families if this is going to continue to be the stance of the company
    • Having two apps may be a support burden for 1Password, but people are far more knowledgable about what an "app" is and what it means to have multiple versions in the app store and it would be pretty easy to distinguish between 1Password and 1Password Family or 1Password For Children
    • Even my kids (including a 6yo) understand the difference between Facebook and Facebook Messenger for Kids, etc. (blame my wife for using FB), people are far more tech savvy than you're giving them credit for (at least as it pertains to apps, they still don't know a thing about security which is why this is an important topic for parents teaching their kids good habits)
    • I can see the 1Browser being a useful feature, I've used it a couple times (in years of 1Password use for both work and personal), but I echo the sentiments that I may well consider an alternate product so that my 3 kids can use what I need them to be able to use, and is yet another browser really worth losing out on that segment of the market
    • Does seem like the marketing team ought to consider polling the user base, particularly the paid subscribers
  • edited April 26

    As 1Password ist no moving in this topic for about four years now and for some other reasons, I have moved to an alternative product, and today I have canceled my subscription.

  • ag_anaag_ana

    Team Member

    Unfortunately we don't have updates to share about this yet :( At the moment the workaround remains to use the "Ask to Buy" feature. I am sorry that we don't have any more encouraging news to share at this point in time.

  • As already explained mutliple times in this topic, "ask to buy" is NO WORKAROUND for this problem.
    And you still prompt your product as family product. I my opinion this is dishonest and misleading.

  • ag_anaag_ana

    Team Member

    @JMcClane72:

    Sorry to hear that, but thank you again for the feedback! As my colleague Ben wrote, the team is considering how to handle this for the future :+1:

  • edited April 27

    A last word about the build in Browser and 1Password as family product.
    What do you think, how long will it take until Kids discover the 1Password browser, and that they can access content not meant for their age?

  • ag_anaag_ana

    Team Member

    That's indeed one of the aspects to consider, thank you for pointing it out :+1:

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