1Password v8 is a Mistake

a1andreas

• I do think that most of it is, for being an Electron app, is very well implemented. It does not feel slow, like almost all other Electron apps does. It actually starts and unlocks noticeably faster than version 7 which is of course not the expected result of being Electron, but I suspect that it is because the core is built in Rust, and Electron is probably used for as little as possible, for just being able to render the user interface.
• It also does, of course, not feel like a Mac app anymore though, which was probably my favourite part of 1Password up until now. I miss the rubber band scrolling soooo much while using this beta version!
• There are lots of bugs of course, being a pre-beta release so far, but most of that is simply because of that fact that it is an early release, and things like it would have been there even if it was a native app.

I think, after trying it out, having some things that I do like and some things that I don't, that i would actually weirdly be mostly OK with this change if:

• The bugs where fixed (which I expect them to be, at least most of them)
• The Quick access would get to a state where it didn't miss a bunch of features that used to be there
• Rubber Band Scrolling was added. This is so important for making an app feel right in macOS! (no idea how to do that in an Electron app, but I also don't know for sure that it would be impossible, even if I have never seen it done anywhere).

Lars

@FCNV - was there another one? I did not see anything else in our queue, but I'm happy to check again. Was this not it?

jlsobraske

I am a Dashlane user and was a near-convert to 1Password because they have implemented a similar strategy - a web app. They are in the middle of deprecating their native app and I strongly prefer a native app. I read this today to learn that the new technical direction is an Electron app, which is a known resource hog (e.g. MS Teams and Slack). This reminds me of my company's decision in 2013 to choose Adobe Flash over HTML. That didn't work out so well... There HAS to be a better cross-platform solution...

I agree with many others here that from a user's perspective, it's a bad choice to move away from a native app to Electron. I will hold off until further notice.

BTW, after reading this thread, I'd say the criticism is fair, but the last thing @roustem has been is disrespectful, defensive or combative.

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brutos

"First world problems "

My £2 opinion.

Some reactions I have seen on different social channels are just disgusting it really is people acting like spoil brats about a software direction like their life is on the line. Get a bloody grip, man or woman.

1Password developed an app that they believe is best for their long-term strategy and will give users ACROSS platforms the best user experience, whether that is right or wrong only time will tell but give them a chance to deliver because if they don’t I am sure the founders know the consequences of that.

I have been using the windows version of the app since its release and its been good so far still some features missing but I am sure that will come. Having the same feel across my windows, mac, android and IOS devices will enhance my user experience.

I am testing the mac version now and I don’t see any rams issue so far mine is at 67.9MB, they are missing features but I assume they will add these like filtering with tags in the search box.

Keep up the good work 1Password team and you still have lots of support in the community.

blankspace

@roustem

So far, the main complaint is that "it is an Electron app, and it is unacceptable to me because I am a Mac user". There were a few valid points about memory usage and a few notes about visual elements. The new mini (Quick Access) is obviously not finished but it will be. What else am I missing?

Here is a list (note these can/are either bugs or issues with the new format)

1. touch Id not automatically firing
2. the padding, lack of dividers making viewing content difficult. Again I can't stress the absolute ridiculous padding. See picture below
3. lack of native UI components. Why is everything inside the main window. Please separate at least some on the critical elements. The "+ New Item" is a huge one. There are other things I could nitpick but the dropdowns are such a pain in the ass.
4. you've switched how user's switch vaults. The new process is more button clicks, overall it's just a worse design. Either switch it back or let us decide. It makes no sense why it was moved as the old way was absolutely perfect. It also gave us a visual que of what vault we were currently on. With "Vaults" minimized, we have no idea except the text in the search bar.
5. The performance lag, which you've already said you'll look at but it's fairly bad and a massive step backwards
6. quick access not being able to be summoned on any other space. This is huge, again, I've spoken about this a lot but I'm just grouping all the complaints I have // have seen into one large comment. This absolutely needs to be fixed, it's awful to use currently.
7. I still disagree with 1P mini being dropped for quick access, so I'm putting this bullet point here and will die on this hill.
8. quick access at the VERY least needs to be summoned via one click in the menu bar (easy fix)
9. There is an absolutely hilarious bug when you're using 1P8 and RDP. If you summon 1P on top of your RDP full screen, the app somehow merges with RDP. Mission control can no longer access or see it. It's maddening. See image below.
10. quick access not allowing vault changes
11. no local vaults (roustem, we've already have convo's about this so I'll leave it)
12. no QR scanning (I know it's a beta)
13. no custom shortcuts (I know it's already an issue being worked on)
14. setting modal instead of windows. I'm sorry but I hate them. They remove the ability for me to multitask and are so jarring in macos as nothing else uses them.

There are others but It'll look like I'm just fishing for complaints if I list them.

roustem

@jlsobraske Thank you ❤️

Your comment about the web app reminded me about the talk that we did at the NorthSec conference this year. I think if you have a few minutes to watch it you will see that the new 1Password 8 is certainly not a "web app":

https://www.youtube.com/watch?t=5110&v=_P6qI4ahBVk&feature=youtu.be

awn

@roustem: I took the time to watch it. Great presentation to show the effort necessary to rip out all of the things and solve the issues nobody asked for when writing a solid application (Node, Browser, code injection as a feature, ...). But I kept asking myself why you would want to do that? You wouldn't have had any of those challenges (but others) when going for native apps for every platform.
Definitely and interesting talk that mentions a whole lot of issues and reasons around why not to use Electron. There was no mention of even a single security benefit it might bring. Is this because there is none?

And to go with the end of the talk: It might not be impossible to write a secure and good Electron based app - but it's possible to do it without Electron as well.

FCNV

@roustem

Again, I think you are in a dangerous echo chamber here. I'm not personally taking the caveman stance "Electron app bad!" but definitely understand the criticism. I actually don't care what you write it in. I just use it for password management, not rendering Pixar movies. But I still think it's important that whatever language or framework you use, it:

1. Is polished in ways your previous apps were and this one is not.
2. Feels consistent with the OS experience it is on. I know you want to standardize the look across platforms because it is easier, but there is a benefit to making it feel whole with each OS. Mac users value this experience, as you may know.
3. It is performant. We've seen reports of this thing taking up 3-5x resources as 1Password 7.

Please don't be dismissive of these things just because it makes it easier to forge forward with your roadmap. I know it sucks now, but someday you'll be able to look back and tell the story about the time you made a mistake with 1Password 8, listened to the feedback, and made the right decisions with the roadmap and product, even if it wasn't the easy decision. The same way Mark Zuckerberg talks about their misstep with web apps on mobile and t

jlsobraske

Thanks for the link to the video, @roustem . Definitely more than just a “web app.”

For me, the biggest requirements are that my password app is highly performant (i.e., no latency in either the UI or the functionality) AND consumes minimal resources. The look and feel are less important (just don’t make it too cartoon-y like Microsoft’s apps).

How long do you plan on supporting 1PW7 on the Mac before forcing customers to switch to 1PW8? I’d be willing to switch from Dashlane if I had enough time to see how this all shakes out.

blankspace

editing as my other post FINALLY showed up.

gussic

Hi all

If you reach out to the billing team they will work with you to give you pro-rata refunds on your subscriptions.

I hate to do this but it seems the 1P Team aren’t really hearing the feedback - I suspect the only way this will change is if people start voting with their feet and wallets.

To the dev team I am sorry, you guys are awesome and seem like great people but this Electron and refusal to acknowledge you’ve done the wrong thing/made a mistake is just a deal breaker.

I sincerely wish you the best of luck - if you decide to dump electron and do macOS properly I’ll be back.

Cheers

rob

Hey folks, sorry for the delay, we've been a bit swamped. :)

@FCNV polish and performance are things we'll continue to improve through the early access and beta periods. We're certainly not done yet. As for consistency with the OS, we're doing some things on Mac like the beautiful translucent sidebar that not even version 7 has. But overall, you are right, we've made a decision to have consistent design language across our apps.

How long do you plan on supporting 1PW7 on the Mac before forcing customers to switch to 1PW8? I’d be willing to switch from Dashlane if I had enough time to see how this all shakes out.

@jlsobraske there aren't any plans in place to end support for 1Password 7. That's not to say it will never happen, just that it's not something we're looking at right now. Version 8 is not even likely to ship this year, so there's plenty of time to get your feet wet and see what you think.

@gussic thanks for the kind words, and I'm sorry to see you go. I similarly hope we can prove with time that using Electron is not inherently a mistake. :)

gussic

@rob

Unfortunately the use of Electron is inherently a mistake - it has never worked well on macOS and will never work well on macOS.

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