Please bring back Top List View
I just tried out 1Password 7 for Mac and was very disappointed to see that Top List View is no longer an option. I love being able to quickly and easily sort passwords by name, strength, modified date, or anything else and be able to actually see the results. If I sort Top List View by strength, I see all of the strengths of each password without having to click on each one. Very handy! I'm sticking with 1Password 6.
Thanks for an otherwise great product!
1Password user since March 2011.
1Password Version: Not Provided
Extension Version: Not Provided
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Comments
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Hi @herskal
Thanks for taking the time to write this feedback, and to share your workflow with us. If your primary concern. is finding items with low password strength we have some new tools in Watchtower in 1Password 7 that can help with this. Did you get a chance to play around with Watchtower at all? If not I’d highly recommend checking it out:
Use Watchtower to find passwords you need to change
We don’t currently have any plans for top list view in 1Password 7, but we’re always open to customer feedback and perhaps if there is enough demand for it we can consider doing that.
Ben
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I'll reply to you there regarding the other issue. Once you've got that sorted, I encourage you to take a look at Watchtower. It makes it much easier to find and deal with weak, reused, or compromised passwords.
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@Ben @brenty Thanks for the advice. I took a look at Watchtower. I could see that sort of working for me but I still prefer the look and operation of Top List View. I've never cared much for the Left List View that's now the only option in 1Password 7. Being able to click on column headings to sort by any attribute is intuitive, compact, and very quick.
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Sounds good! On Ben and brenty's behalf, you're welcome :)
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Agreed! Watchtower is neat but I want my list-only view! I don't need icons and I want to be able to sort easily by headings. I'm actually kinda shocked this was left out. Many thanks.
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schwaggy is right, please bring back list view; 50$ for no list view, orly.
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We don't have any plans to bring back List View. Maintaining it was not trivial, and the vast majority of users have not used it since 2009 when 1Password 3 was released. I was a fan of it myself, so I get where you're coming from, but we rally need to focus on the things that benefit the greatest number of 1Password users. :blush:
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@brenty how do you know that the majority of users didn't use it?
It wasn't my default view but sometimes it was indispensable when searching for something (esp. modified date).
[edit: added my use case]
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We comunicate with customers many, many times every day. Thanks for sharing your use case! Have you tried using 1Password's advanced search options? :)
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@harczuk: Honestly "we'll consider it" is a good answer most of the time, and very true. But we've been considering List View for nearly a decade now and decided to finally put it to rest with version 7. You're probably right that there's a lot we can do to make 1Password more usable for a greater number of people, but List View is not it. As busy as we are with the new version being released, if there were serious problems we'd know it: we would be much, much busier. You're totally right though that we need to consider non-techies more, and it's a direction we've been moving in. After all, like you said, most people aren't beta testers. My family sure isn't. Nothing is set in stone, so we'll keep doing what we believe is best based on our instincts and user feedback of all kinds, and when we need to, we'll backtrack. I just don't see that happening with List View after all this time, so I wanted to be upfront about that. Thanks for understanding. And if there are things we need to do better with Watchtower and search to help you more in this area, we're listening. :)
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You can't please all the people all the time, but you can try to please some of the people some of the time. This isn't one of those times. I loath this new interface, specifically not being able to get rid of the space-eating icons - whether rich icons or not, there they are HUGE and in my face. List view was so clean and simple. Being able to easily sort my the heading I wanted to and see MANY lines of logins in the list instead of only about 20 or so now (on my 13" Mac) with big icons. I'm no developer but to say maintaining what seems to me a simple list view as "not trivial" just sounds lazy. Can you elaborate why it's so difficult to maintain this interface option?
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@schwaggy: Any time there's more code, there's more bugs. We've closed a number of issues that were filed around that which we could never justify prioritizing given how little feedback we got on that and how much we got on the side view and other features customers wanted. And maintaining the code is only part of it. When list view was still a thing, we had to design around that too. There's a lot we didn't add to 1Password years ago because it wouldn't have worked there. Maybe that sounds crazy. But we moved away from that mindset over time, and that broke things there. Almost no one was using it — including us — and it just didn't make sense to maintain it anymore. All work can seem trivial when someone else has to do it. And even if there are things we could have done to shore it up in a relatively short amount of time, we don't have anyone sitting around with nothing to do, and there just hasn't been demand for it anyway. :blush:
I can't promise that we'll make any or all of the other changes you're looking for, but feel free to post in other discussions with feedback in those specific areas. We're definitely listening. :)
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It's a bit disappointing that you give up on power users. I store 1000+ items separated by projects. It was very convenient to see all my passwords per project on one screen. Now I see only 9 items with this these big icons and huge letters.
On the other hand 1P mini became more powerful. I even stretched it from top to bottom. But 1P Mini became very laggy. It renders so slow. Plus quick copy shortcut doesn't work most of the times. Tech support said that they got it fixed, but in Version 7.0.5.BETA-0 (70005000) it's still painful.
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It's a bit disappointing that you give up on power users.
I’m not sure I’d agree that is a fair assessment of what has happened here. But we do appreciate your perspective on the issue. Perhaps we can still find a way to get more data on the screen.
On the other hand 1P mini became more powerful. I even stretched it from top to bottom.
That’s great to hear. :)
But 1P Mini became very laggy. It renders so slow. Plus quick copy shortcut doesn't work most of the times. Tech support said that they got it fixed, but in Version 7.0.5.BETA-0 (70005000) it's still painful.
Hmm. I’ve got well over 1000 items and 1Password mini is still snappy for me. Could you please post the support ID you have going so that we can follow up?
Thanks.
Ben
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I am another user who tried v7 and cannot live without the top item list view. I constantly log in and out of healthcare pages that log you out quickly for security reasons. I keep the 1 Password UI open at all time and navigate back and forth between browser and UI. I need a UI that shows a 'compact' list of items. The lack of collapsible sub-folders in v7 is also a drawback for me, but I could live with the tags and sub-tags.
However, all the wasted UI real estate without the top item list view makes a big decrease in productivity for me. I reversed to v6 for the time being. When v6 becomes too obsolete, I hope I can find a better UI for my needs from the various solutions out there, if your team does not come up with a better option. Seems like you must be targeting a consumer experience rather than business users.0 -
Adding to my previous comment, after reading in more details the response from @brenty to schwaggy:
Seems like what schwaggy and I need is simply to maximize the use of the real estate UI: get rid of the huge icon, minimize spacing between item title, bring the list to the top and the detailed item view to the bottom (like in v6).
With the top/bottom layout, having the field name and field value horizontally (versus one below the other) in the detailed item view is also a better use of the view real estate.
Implementing this without bringing any fields other than the item title to the list view, is a simple UI development effort that should not create heavy maintenance effort (speaking from experience as a developer).0 -
@etm: We do tend to prioritize things that improve the experience for the majority of 1Password users, rather than trying to cater only to a small subset. 1Password mini is pretty compact though, and if you've got the 1Password extension installed in your browser it will show you logins matching the current website by default when you open it.
I can appreciate that something like Top View is useful when scrolling through the list, spreadsheet style, but that's just not how most people use 1Password; it becomes less and less feasible the more people use 1Password and accumulate more data there, and that's what inevitably happens over time: people are storing more things as opposed to less. I suspect that's a big part of why there are so few people that even noticed that Top View has slowly faded over the past decade, until it was removed completely in version 7.
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Hello again Brenty
So I come over from the iOS Forum to plea for the Top View revival in the Mac App v7. How exactly do You determine which view most people use - does AgileBit get some feedback on the settings ?I for my 2 cents think that the Finder analogy is a good one. It would be to simple to only have one view because some think it will do - and Apple honors that. I've seen tons of people over the last 30 years using one or the other view as their preferred one - or also changing it depending on the task at hand. And yes Excel style browsing can be very handy at some times & change listings with a single click is convenient. And last but not least on a small Font on the new MBP 2018 15" it is way better readable - even without glasses. I'm still hoping for more variety in 1P Land ;-)
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So I come over from the iOS Forum to plea for the Top View revival in the Mac App v7. How exactly do You determine which view most people use - does AgileBit get some feedback on the settings ?
We don’t collect general usage statistics. We value our customer’s privacy too much to do that. We do get this information when we collect diagnostic reports or screenshots from customers. As that isn’t the purpose of the interaction we don’t have that information formally coalesced for statistical analysis, but I can honestly say that I interact with many hundreds of customers per month and I can’t remember the last time I saw someone using top view. That really isn’t the point though. Especially with Mojave coming we already have to maintain two entirely separate sets of assets and have two views to maintain (dark mode and light mode). We don’t feel top view offers enough value to maintain four. It would mean a fair amount of development time that could be better spent elsewhere.
Considering only a couple dozen people have written to us about this feature of the millions of 1Password users that does seem to be pretty good anecdotal evidence that it wasn’t a popular option. As with anything there are of course some workflows where it fit better, but we have to prioritize our limited resources.
I challenge them to put out some real poll that gets all of their customers, say an email.
While customer feedback is certainly important to us it isn’t the only factor and features aren’t decided democratically. Even if that were how it worked and we were willing to do that I can almost guarantee you there are more folks who would stop using 1Password simply because we “spammed” them with such an email than would vote for top view. Additionally sending such an email (to “all of [our] customers”) would be impossible — we don’t have email addresses for many of our customers. Sending out such an email isn’t something we’re going to do, but we will continue to evaluate the feedback we receive through traditional means (i.e. this forum, emails, social media, etc).
Ben
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@harczuk: You're not wrong, but with millions of users, we'd be hearing from more than a half dozen or so people about this change. We also get feedback via email and social media of course, but it doesn't come up any more often there. The only people who would even notice that Top View/List View went away were those using it, and of course the few of us here at 1Password.
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@MikDev: Hello again to you too, and thanks for your passion about this! If you read the discussion above, you'll note that I rather liked Top View/List View myself, so I get where you're coming from. Finder is an interesting example though, because not only do most people with Macs just use the default icon view and never even think to try to change it, you're probably aware that Finder has suffered from a great many bugs and inconsistencies since OS X was created nearly two decades ago. I don't think that's a coincidence, as customizable stuff like this involves a lot more possible interactions that a monolithic view does. And — all respect to Apple, because they have to prioritize their work too, and they make great stuff — if a huge company like that isn't able to address these sorts of things, I think we'd be kidding ourselves to think that we'll fare much better, especially given there's a large number of other things we're working on and also waiting on our todo list. It's not impossible that interest in a different sort of UI than 1Password has today will develop in the future, but as it stands now there just isn't interest in this reaching even the level of some of the lower priority things we need to work on. :(
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I've not tried 1Password 7 on Mac yet, I'm still using 1Password 6 there. But I've just tried out 1Password 7 on Windows and I too absolutely miss the list view.
AgileBits folks, the list view really needs to come back in both versions, please.
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@warpspeed - thanks for the feedback. My suspicion is that this won't be happening, based on the number of users who made use of it enough to lament its removal, but we appreciate you taking the time to let us know it was a feature you found valuable. :)
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