Set default collection/vault for saving in 1Password 8
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I have passed along your comments to the team.
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The more I use 1P and the Community, I am very pleased when my ashes are spread on a mountain, my wife will have a good understanding on using 1P and THE FANTASTIC SUPPORT TEAM. 👍👍👍👍👍👍👍
(yea I know it's kind of funny)
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@Ben @PeterG_1P @ag_tommy @Jack.P_1P OK folks Dave just sent out the big email saying that 1P8 for Mac is coming out of beta "real soon now," as in two weeks. So you MUST be able to tell us by now whether or not the "default vault for new entries" feature is going to make it into the shipping version. And if it's not, can you please have Dave himself reply on this thread explaining why the decision was made NOT to include this critically useful feature that existed in the prior release? Those of us who manage very young and very old 1Password users in our families really CANNOT live without it!
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Hi @DanBrotsky, greetings. 👋
This one may not make the 1Password 8 for Mac general release. While this might not be a satisfying answer to folks who have advocated for a return to the 1Password 7 implementation of this feature, here are a couple things to consider.
The first stable release of 1Password 8 for Mac won't be the last. As its sibling app 1Password 8 for Windows has already shown, we keep iterating and improving things at every step. And in this case, we have lots of cool stuff planned for future updates, and will develop more that aren’t already planned based on feedback we receive.
When it comes to challenges like this one - what should the default vault for the creation of new items be, and how should it be set? - we may not solve those challenges in the same ways we've done before. Version 8 gives us an opportunity to revisit past assumptions and make things even better.
The 1Password 7 approach, while helpful for scenarios like the ones folks have thoughtfully outlined here, also has drawbacks: we've seen people accidentally sharing private items via shared vaults that were set as the default (which the user had overlooked or forgotten). So we're taking an opportunity to review how this is done.
Importantly, we're not taking v7 away — it works great on Monterey and we’re not aware of any upcoming changes that’ll break it. It's stable and secure and works really well. And for folks who have a specific use case like this one, we recommend sticking with that for now.
Most importantly, we want to continue to hear about the challenges you face. We are set on making 1Password 8 the best 1Password app to date, and while that might mean some changes from what you're used to, we ultimately do want to solve these kinds of challenges in a way that benefits you.
TL;DR: If you have an acute need for default vault saving to work the way it does in 1Password 7, we recommend sticking with that app for now. We also want to continue to have your feedback and understand your use cases so that we can iterate on 1Password 8 in a way that makes the "default vault for new entries" behavior work for as many people as possible.
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Hi @PeterG_1P, thanks for giving us both the specific answer we've been looking for - no, this feature will not be in the general release on Mac - and the bigger picture about why it's not yet a defined feature on the roadmap.
With respect to the bigger picture: Is it possible for the users here to talk directly with product management about their specific concerns with this feature as it exists today in 1Password7? There are a lot of experienced administrators in this thread that could give you a lot of background about what they need.
For example, you mention that users may accidentally share private secrets unintentionally because they don't notice they are saving into the default vault. But that concern is unrelated to whether there's a default vault, because the way the 1Password 8 interface works there's always some vault shown initially, and there's no way that can always be the "right" vault for every new secret.
What we are asking for in this thread is that administrators be able to set, for specific users, which vault is the one that is initially offered whenever the user goes to save a new credential. We are not asking that users not be able to override that, so this doesn't force them to put secrets somewhere they don't want.
If you look back at the history of this feature in 1Password7, you will find that our initial ask was for administrative access to the "Private" vault of specific users. That was denied for privacy reasons, and the "default vault" was provided instead. With 1Password 8 introducing an explicit vault selection capability with every new save, it's hard for us (or at least me) to understand why this feature can't be continued into version 8 simply by using that default as the starting point for every new save instead of whatever heuristic product management has currently decided to use (which is, as far as I can tell, to start with the last vault saved into).
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Hi,
I'm considering moving my family's password management to 1password but the changing "vault for saving" setting (available in version 7) is critical for us for the future versions. I think it is extremely useful for most families.
I'm still on a two week trial and I'm OK to use version 7 and start the subscription as long as there is commitment to restore this in version 8 (or at least on the website account management page).
Is there any decision on this 3 months after the challenge?
Thanks,
Zoltan0 -
Hi,
Forget my comment above, I figured out how to do it :)
Z.
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Hi @CitizenYoli
Would you mind sharing what you found that is working for you? We don't have plans to implement this as it was in 1Password 7, but I think there are others that would be interested in a way to accomplish a similar outcome. What did you land on?
Ben
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Hi,
Sure. I use a Mac, so not sure if the same applies for Windows.
On the Safari plugin you can actually set up directly which vault you want to save the passwords in the settings ('Save new Items in') so that's easy for Safari website login password management (instead of using Apple's keychain).
For the mac app, I set up a Vault collection for each family member (top left drop down 'Manage Collections' and then press '+ New Collection') and then for each person I only selected their own vault (from the list on the right side). This way whoever I select from the top left drop down vault collection selector will become the default vault for new password entries.
For instance let's assume you created a "Dad" vault (via the web account management page) and then created a vault selection in the app only assigning the "Dad" vault as explained above. Now when you click on 'new item' (top right corner on the app UI) and select any category, you can see on the bottom right corner of the window that it is saving in the "Dad" Vault Selection. Since you only assigned the "Dad" vault to the "Dad" vault selection, this is where it will save it.
Another thing (to my knowledge) 1password is currently missing to key competitors is legacy management. With the above logic it is a breeze to set it up as long as you fully trust the person you share your passwords with today (not only when you're gone...). In the above example, I added my wife as 'Read only' to the 'Dad' vault. So she can see my passwords but I don't have to manage this separately. All I need to make sure that 'Dad' is selected in the Vault Collection Selector. This set up opens up opportunities to manage children's password entry in a way that they will automatically share their passwords with you (and not in their private folder), too.
The key thing is to understand that Vaults (created on the web admin page) and Vault Collections (created in the app) are two different things and while this creates confusion and complexity (IMHO), it opens up lots of opportunities to set up 1password8 the way you want.
This works for me, I'm just hoping this will not change in the next version again :)
Zoltan
PS: btw I love the new design of the mac app but the iPhone app design seems a bit dated. Any plans to update that too for version 8?
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Hey @DanBrotsky:
I completely understand and recognize the disruption to your workflow, when having to select the appropriate vault for saving. I can assure you that the idea of default vaults is something we've brought up with our development team. We understand the background around this, and we'll continue to champion it on your behalf. Hopefully we'll see this feature make a comeback in a future release.
Jack
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On the Safari plugin you can actually set up directly which vault you want to save the passwords in the settings ('Save new Items in')
That's a great callout, @CitizenYoli, thanks. 👍
For the mac app, I set up a Vault collection
This makes sense, thanks for explaining!
Another thing (to my knowledge) 1password is currently missing to key competitors is legacy management
I would love to see us solve this nicely. It's the old saying about the number of hours in a day, but I hope we'll be able to come back to this. Out of curiosity, would you expect this to just be time based, as in, we'll allow access to your data X days after sending a notification to your email address that your emergency contact has requested it? Or would you expect the emergency contact to need to authenticate their request with a death certificate?
The key thing is to understand that Vaults (created on the web admin page) and Vault Collections (created in the app) are two different things
I'm not sure if it's clear, but you can also create vaults in 1Password 8 on your Mac using the + button next to your account name. If you want to manage who has access to those vaults, though, you'll still have to do that from the web app or another app.
I love the new design of the mac app but the iPhone app design seems a bit dated. Any plans to update that too for version 8?
Yep! We are indeed working on 1Password 8 for iOS as well. Stay tuned for news on that.
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Hi Rob, answering to your Q re legacy mgmt, yes I'd prefer time based as you described. If you already nominated an emergency contact that you trust with your passwords, I would just allow say up to a week gap between the email notification (maybe backed up with a mobile text notification too given its seriousness) and the access granting.
Sadly I have experience arranging a death certificate and in my country during the COVID time, it took more than a month to get it. In some countries it will be issued only in local language and it would put extra administrative task on your team to manage it case by case, which would increase both costs and lead times. Also let's be honest unless you check the certificate authenticity case by case with the issuing authorities (you'd need a separate team for that...) anyone can send you a Photoshopped certificate.
That's why I believe the emergency contact selection is more robust as every person is free to choose the person they trust for themselves. After that a time gap would just add an extra layer of security to avoid mistakes or misuse. I would just make sure all users are communicated about the implications when then select their emergency contact. Of course all this needs to be checked with legal experts, which I'm not.
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it would put extra administrative task on your team to manage it case by case
Yes, I think if we went that route we would find another company to do that verification for us, someone who specializes in that.
But it would still be far easier to avoid that hassle and just have a time gap, so I'm glad to hear that matches your expectations. 😎👍
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Hi 1password product team,
any news about the missing feature? Can you confirm that this well known old feature comes back again and is placed on your roadmap? Do you have an ETA? It sounds very easy to implement some code asking for the default vault and use it with new objects.Maybe my perfect programming knowledges can help you (for you, of course, free to use - no copyright!):
Preferences:
≤input type="text" name="DefaultVault"≥ ≤PullDownMenu of all vaults≥
New Objects:
≤h2≥Store new object to ≤/h2≥: ≤PullDownMenu of all vaults, selected=$DefaultVault≥So, where is the problem to wait so long for such a simple feature? ;-)
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Hey 1PW Team,
I just upgraded to V8 today, and one of the first things I looked for was default vaults (which then lead me to this thread). The new version is awesome, and I think I'll really love it, however not having the default vault functionality really is a deal breaker for me.
I have been a 1PW junkie since my wife and I got married almost 5 years ago, and have since talked a multitude of friends and family members into using it (honestly, it's been more than I can keep track of). The "game winning pitch" for all of them was:
"Not only can you share all of your passwords with your spouse, but whenever you create a new one it automatically shares it! No additional work needed." (This was once I helped them set it up this way)
Like many have stated in this thread, the vast majority those who I have referred to use 1PW are either elderly, not the most tech literate, or just don't care about security (but realized they needed something better than a physical notebook or Excel spreadsheet with a bunch of passwords, or re-using the same one with one changed character). For everyone, the ease and simplicity of "it automatically creates and shares the password with who matters" was critical.
I genuinely hope this gets corrected for V8, because I think a ton of the features are worth upgrading for. However, until this is rolled out, I will be recommending to everyone that they stay on V7 until this is fixed... otherwise, I'll be getting phone calls of "why can't I see new passwords XYZ created anymore??"
Thanks for all of your hard work on this!
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Hey 1PW Team,
I just upgraded to V8 today, and one of the first things I looked for was default vaults (which then lead me to this thread). The new version is awesome, and I think I'll really love it, however not having the default vault functionality really is a deal breaker for me.
I have been a 1PW junkie since my wife and I got married almost 5 years ago, and have since talked a multitude of friends and family members into using it (honestly, it's been more than I can keep track of). The "game winning pitch" for all of them was:
"Not only can you share all of your passwords with your spouse, but whenever you create a new one it automatically shares it! No additional work needed." (This was once I helped them set it up this way)
Like many have stated in this thread, the vast majority those who I have referred to use 1PW are either elderly, not the most tech literate, or just don't care about security (but realized they needed something better than a physical notebook or Excel spreadsheet with a bunch of passwords). For everyone I worked with, the ease and simplicity of "it automatically creates and shares the password with who matters" was critical.
I genuinely hope this gets corrected for V8, because I think a ton of the features are worth upgrading for. However, until this is rolled out, I will be recommending to everyone that they stay on V7 until this is fixed... otherwise, I'll be getting phone calls of "why can't I see new passwords XYZ created anymore??"
Thanks for all of your hard work on this!
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1Password 8 uses 1Password in the browser. Have you tried changing the default save location there?
Get to know 1Password in your browser
Let me know if that helps.
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Hey ag_tommy,
Thanks for the quick reply! This is good to know, and solves about 75% of the issues. There are still cases where websites don't create passwords automatically (or the auto-fill function is broken), and the user needs to create one manually in 1PW.
That said, this will probably be "good enough" for now, though I'd still love to see the default as an option across all devices/web browsers. Thanks!
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I agree this likely needs some love, and I also help with some older relatives. I can entirely relate. Thanks for sharing your use case. I'll let the team know this is important.
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Just upgraded and immediately went to check for what was my default vault. Please bring back the ability to define a default vault!!! - and the ability to remove the personal vault altogether. I will not be able to have the family members upgrade or this will create chaos! I did find the default vault setting for 1Password in the browser but that would be a minority of cases for my family + another setting I need to run around a bunch of computers & devices to make. - TIA Barry
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As someone who has championed 1P since version 1 and wrote the review on the Huffington Post, I also request that the "default vault" preference — for both opening to and saving to — be restored as soon as possible! The whole point of the shared vault was to share with family members, with the private vault being PRIVATE. For years I used Dropbox as a workaround so my wife and I were saving our passwords in the same place … and I could easily shore up some of the mistakes she might make as she is not tech-inclined. Plus, of course, she'd have access to all my passwords in case something happened to me.
The shared vault was a far more elegant solution, which was a big selling point in my review. To take that preference away is, in my humble opinion, INSANE and the justifications given above don't hold water. I believe far more of us have been using 1P vaults in the way I and others have outlined here, and instances of "mistakenly" sharing something are relatively few in comparison. So yes, please bring this back as soon as possible!!
BTW, I had to create an account to post this (my old one had apparently expired), and guess what? Even though I had the shared vault active and selected within 1P 8, the new 1P item for this support board was saved in… you guessed it… the Private vault. That means I cannot endorse v8 nor recommend it for any of my clients (or my wife!) until this functionality is restored.
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I loved this feature and please bring it back. I don‘t need the private vault and normally use „Shared“ and „Work“.
Today I found a workaround: Collections. https://support.1password.com/collections/
I created a collection with only the „Shared“-Vault and now all new logins will be stored in „Shared“. Created a second collection which only contains the vault „Work“ and I am able to switch between the two collections.
When starting 1Password again, the last collection used seems to be activated by default.
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@vstrom650, thanks for sharing your use case, and I'm glad that the Collections feature has been helpful for you.
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@KenGruberman - first, thank you for your long-time support of 1Password. I would have loved to see that review!
While I don't have any news to add on this subject at the moment beyond the post I shared back on page 1, I do want you to know that I have passed along your comments to our development team so they can consider the implications for privacy, sharing, and design as a whole.
Thanks again for taking the time to share this in detail.
ref: IDEA-I-292
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Hi PeterG — you CAN still see that 2010 review! It used to be featured on 1P's blog pages a long time ago; however, I just found that it still is alive and kicking at https://www.huffpost.com/entry/one-password-to-rule-them_b_487970 …
A couple of things that need to be improved RIGHT AWAY about using 1P 8 for the first time:
• I followed vstrom650's comments above about COLLECTIONS and found his advice a workable solution. New entries are now correctly saved into the Shared Vault, which is also the one being displayed whenever 1P 8 opens, and the Personal vault remains hidden. Since Collections is a new feature, I would not have easily figured out this is now the way multiple vaults are being handled instead of the "older" way.I think that 1P 8 should prompt the user during the initial setup to use this feature! For example, a dialog could have come up that said "you are using more than one vault: would you like me to help you create which one should be the default?" etc. A helper tool would then guide the user into creating a Collection that mirrors the way 1P 7 worked.
• Also during the initial launch, there was no prompt, notice, dialog, or anything else mentioning correctly setting macOS 12 Monterey's permissions. I am in the habit of checking the SECURITY & PRIVACY — PRIVACY system preference's settings whenever I install an app that interacts with other apps and system functions, so I did check and sure enough, there were checkboxes there for 1P that were unchecked. This is a major oversight. BTW, the 3rd time I launched 1P 8 I did get a notice to set the Accessibility preference… even though I had already done so!! Thought y'all should know.
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I would also like to add to the body of users that wants this functionality back from 1P7. While the Collections advice is workable, and the browser extension does have this functionality, those are a bit complicated for the use case that is SO important to so many - default sharing with close family.
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I just installed 1P8 (from 1P7) on my parents computer... now I have to roll it back because you took out a critical feature? This is kind of unacceptable as it cripples a major use case for which families choose 1P.
I can appreciate that during beta, things get shuffled around and broken, but this needs to be a priority fix. I don't want to have to go back to Bitwarden.
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Jumping on here to add my vote for being able to set the default vault for saving in version 8.
The amount of times I have to deal with... the login information is not there in a team or family setting is driving me nuts. Simply because previously it defaulted to the shared vault and now it just sits in "someone's" private vault because their attention span while creating passwords tends towards 0. I'll be downgrading everyone back to 7 in the meantime.0
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